Is Royal Mints legal tender promise worthless?

[Guest]

Banks are now under orders not to cash royal mint legal tender commemoratives.

 

Full story

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/news/article-3390519/I-buy-Royal-Mint-commemorative-coins-bulk-credit-card-gain-airmiles-cash-bank-s-refusing-accept-them.html

[whitesands1]

7 minutes ago, Numistacker said:

Banks are now under orders not to cash royal mint legal tender commemoratives.

http://youtu.be/hLkQYFFzldQ

Full story

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/news/article-3390519/I-buy-Royal-Mint-commemorative-coins-bulk-credit-card-gain-airmiles-cash-bank-s-refusing-accept-them.html

These are mis-marketed and the Royal Mint has been caught out!  Maybe should call them Legal Tender style coins!  All smacks of a greedy plan that went wrong.

[BaldyBob]

Great subject & informative vid.

They will always be worth their value in silver, and that is about it. Unless you can sell as a collectable, and that takes time and effort.

For me, I avoid any commemorative coins, gold or silver.

[Stu]

It is the thin end of the wedge, the Royal Mint are increasingly taking their customers for a ride and I will be purchasing very little, if anything from them in the future. 

[whitesands1]

Just shows how hard it is to make money honestly now.  If there is traction to this as a public interest story people might question the value of issued coinage.  The face value to the value of the metal is much the same, i.e. the face value is greater than the metal content.

Contrast this to bullion where the face value is lower than nominal value BUT you have to pay V.A.T. on the cost!

[Guest]

It really is just greed and market manipulation. RM are probably no worse than others but this is like having your cake and eating it and to me it seems an unfair business practice at least.

[whitesands1]

@ Numistacker - liked the waste paper bin!  Nice touch!

[motorbikez]

38 minutes ago, Numistacker said:

It really is just greed and market manipulation. RM are probably no worse than others but this is like having your cake and eating it and to me it seems an unfair business practice at least.

Or to put it rather less subtly, RM are taking the p--s & moving the goalposts after an ordinary punter challenged them by going OTT to get airmiles.

[HawkHybrid]

there are max 10 coins per household address. royal mint

'could' do the decent thing and block the same credit cards

being used on multiple addresses, thus fixing the problem at

source. it looks like these coins may end up being limited

edition after all.

 

HH

[BaldyBob]

Maybe someone should take this to trading standards

The advertising is clearly misleading.  From the RM website

 

 

Sir Winston Churchill 2015 UK £20 Fine Silver Coin

• Struck in 999 fine silver – a £20 coin for £20
• Highly collectable – just 200,000 available
• Our last face value silver coin sold out in days
• An official UK coin and a respectful tribute

[watchesandwhisky]

Ok I had a hard time cashing in mine..Actually I could not (tried two banks and two post offices about 6 months ago) and sold them all and never bought more..But this is just pathetic,

I like some of their coins, but cannot ever see them as a viable investment anymore.

[Clens92]

I have a few hundred quid of the £20 / £50 coins... This doesn't really concern me.  The only thing that matters is that they technically remain legal tender - they can be paid to the court to service a debt.  So it is still 'good' money, but not everyone is obligated to take it.  And there's always the off chance that silver goes to the moooooooon!

 

On a side note, would the Old Lady cover it like they do with old de-monetised coinage?  i.e. You can still send a sixpence or ten shilling note to the Bank of England, and they will send you the equivalent amount in decimal coinage.  Would be interesting to know.

[HelpingHands]

I'm not sure that's true with old coins.  I know banknotes can always be redeemed but I've got a feeling that old coins are no good for exchange.

[Pipers]

Osborne the Chancellor stood at the despatch box and called them £20 coins (he was rather pleased with himself) he as acted like a snake oil salesman never telling you what you are getting!!!

They are either a coins or not, why else would anyone buy a silver 1/2 ounce round when one could buy a 1 ounce coin a Britannia for £7 less 

Note court debts, courts can refuse payments by these coins too and debt collection agents and sheriffs won't take payment at face value.  

I will not buy any ROyal mint special coins anymore. 

 

[Pipers]

3 hours ago, Clens92 said:

I have a few hundred quid of the £20 / £50 coins... This doesn't really concern me.  The only thing that matters is that they technically remain legal tender - they can be paid to the court to service a debt.  So it is still 'good' money, but not everyone is obligated to take it.  And there's always the off chance that silver goes to the moooooooon!

 

On a side note, would the Old Lady cover it like they do with old de-monetised coinage?  i.e. You can still send a sixpence or ten shilling note to the Bank of England, and they will send you the equivalent amount in decimal coinage.  Would be interesting to know.

Probably not though you could write to them.  

[motorbikez]

@Clens92 As per Clens92 it doesn't really concern me, as a collector I only buy coins I like, the only so called legal tender/ face value coin I bought was 2 X £100 big ben coins because I like them. I haven't bought any of the £20/£50 coins nor the new Buckingham Palace £100 coin as I'm not struck on any of those.

Moral of the story don't buy them unless you are happy to keep them.

[Guest]

@Clens92 As per Clens92 it doesn't really concern me, as a collector I only buy coins I like, the only so called legal tender/ face value coin I bought was 2 X £100 big ben coins because I like them. I haven't bought any of the £20/£50 coins nor the new Buckingham Palace £100 coin as I'm not struck on any of those.

Moral of the story don't buy them unless you are happy to keep them.

Good advice. It's not that they are bad if the collector market supports them. I will probably buy a few of each 20£

[garthy]

I've always looked at these coins as a inflation/deflation hedge but seeing that the Royal Mint are now instructing banks not to except them it's a bit of a kick in the teeth for the consumer.

To me if the mint allows someone to buy more than one of these coins and the credit card company is happy to give air miles and that somebody has capitalised on this then why is it any concern of the mint? I'm afraid that's capitalism but as always when the little man uses the system to their advantage the powers that be don't like it.

This is another poor show from the royal mint, they should let people know the true facts before selling these to the public.

 

 

[whitesands1]

Just be straightforward and honest.  I takes many years to build up a good reputation.  It doesn't take long at all to ruin one.

[Murph]

Very strange writing to the banks and also saying  "Banks have never been obliged to accept face value coins, although some may have decided to do so at their own discretion." Why not leave banks to decide themselves.  What about the P.O. have they stopped as well?

 

[Euromir]

Guessing the fella can rack up a huge pile of court fines now though...Maybe whilst hes enjoying those free flights.

[KDave]

I don't have any of these coins but this strikes me as a very deceitful and greedy thing to do. Doubly so from the long standing and respected Royal Mint. 

Is this misselling or is it just deceitfully taking advantage of peoples lack of understanding? Either way reputation and future custom has been lost for some short term profit. What a shame.

 

 

[HelpingHands]

Somebody get on to Watchdog as it's quite a good story for TV.

Not me though, I'm already doing my share of complaining. 

 

[MCJ]

I've just received an email from the Royal Mint having sent them a snotty note via their website.

Their reply below,(Complete with RM spin)

Dear xxx,

Thank you for taking the trouble to get in touch with us. 

In answer to your note, may I first make clear the fact that The Royal Mint does not promote commemorative coins as an investment - they are intended as keepsakes. The Royal Mint offers a specific portfolio for that purpose, for example, The Royal Mint’s bullion range.

Commemorative coins are not intended for daily commercial transactions, and therefore business and banks are not obliged to accept them. There is an arrangement with some main Post Offices to accept £5 crowns at their discretion in exchange for goods and services, but this does not extend to any other commemorative coins, including those in the face value range.

Only circulating legal tender coins are designed to be spent and traded at business and banks. Our face value coin range is aimed at collectors and gift buyers who appreciate the detailed hand finished process and expert skills used to make them.

In closing, the letter sent by Cheryl Morgan on behalf of The Royal Mint on the 5th January does not refer to a new policy. It has never been the case that banks have been obliged to accept £20, £50 and £100 commemorative pieces as cash, as they are not circulating legal tender; the letter is a reiteration of this fact, so that banks have confirmation that there has been no change to the existing policy.

 

Kind Regards

 

Allyson Bowden

 

Customer Service Manager

[garthy]

Nice work MCJ.

In that case they should make this clear when purchasing, I'm done with the royal mint.