Checking if coins are fake

[HappyGirl1]

I have been collecting for about 4 months now and  I have been getting most of my full gold sovereigns of ebay  , I only really started to think to actually maybe  I should check if there not fakes after reading about a few people getting fakes .

I have a Coin size identify check for fake coins,  I got this of ebay all the coins fit the sizes for the full gold sovereigns ,  I have got scales the readings are with dates of coins   1911 / 7.995g , 1913/ 7.974g , 1912/ 7.970g  , 1912/ 7.977   .

I am a little bit confused of what a full gold sovereigns weight can be so dose the data for my coins look good?

[Pete]

Your weights fall well inside the tolerances for full sovereigns that have been in circulation.
The specified weight is 7.988 for an uncirculated coin and you may find coins over 8.0g
With wear and tear you will typically loose about 0.5-0.75% so down to about 7.93 g.

Provided the weights are in range - which yours are - and they are the correct diameter then the giveaway of a fake is it will be noticeably thicker.
Don't immediately panic if you are comparing just the rims as some coins have protruding rims or less wear on the edges.
 

[HappyGirl1]

10 minutes ago, Pete said:

Your weights fall well inside the tolerances for full sovereigns that have been in circulation.
The specified weight is 7.988 for an uncirculated coin and you may find coins over 8.0g
With wear and tear you will typically loose about 0.5-0.75% so down to about 7.93 g.

Provided the weights are in range - which yours are - and they are the correct diameter then the giveaway of a fake is it will be noticeably thicker.
Don't immediately panic if you are comparing just the rims as some coins have protruding rims or less wear on the edges.
 

Thanks for your help , I guess it puts my mind at rest knowing the weights all add up , 

[sixgun]

if you are buying coins regularly i would sign up as a premium member. You will be able to see the coins for sale on the selling side of the forum straight away. You will see lots of nice coins coming up for sale. Another good place for sovereigns is http://www.hattongardenmetals.com/buy/cid0/all-stock . They have got a bit more expensive recently but their basic sovereigns are some of the best prices.

[ChrisF]

Is it just me or are Sovereigns like petrol, fast to rise but slow to fall?

[BackyardBullion]

Always worth knowing your weights and measures!

I was out in Wales a few months ago and did not know these Stats on Sovereigns. If I had them committed to memory I would have bought some awesome looking shieldback's for spot!

But the deal seemed too good to be true!

[tbone]

For a long time, I was scared of buying gold on ebay, unless its from a dealer.  So if you're starting out, you might want to stick to larger dealers, or maybe from members on this forum that have been around for a while.  I'm much more experienced now at detecting fakes (although they are getting really good), and I also use a Precious Metal Verifier so I'll know if it isn't the composition it should be.  A cheaper option would be a Fisch tester, which checks the width, diameter, and weight, although its not 100%.

But sovereigns are well known for being faked, and buying from ebay you need to be careful.  Try buying a 10x loupe and examine them closely, looking for any differences.  You'll get better at finding the more obvious fakes over time.

[Pete]

15 hours ago, BackyardBullion said:

Always worth knowing your weights and measures!

I was out in Wales a few months ago and did not know these Stats on Sovereigns. If I had them committed to memory I would have bought some awesome looking shieldback's for spot!

But the deal seemed too good to be true!

Kicking yourself no doubt.
What kind of shop has sovereigns for sale ?
If near Anglesey I might want to drop in later this month. 
I've never seen a coin shop in the UK other than in York city centre and their prices were way OTT.

[tbone]

14 minutes ago, Pete said:

I've never seen a coin shop in the UK other than in York city centre and their prices were way OTT.

Interesting, I always assumed UK buyers had an easier time finding sovereigns.  I'm in the US and my LCS usually has avg circ sovs for fairly decent prices.  Nothing special, but they are almost as common as Krugs or eagles.  Maybe my LCS is not the norm tho.

[BackyardBullion]

2 hours ago, Pete said:

Kicking yourself no doubt.
What kind of shop has sovereigns for sale ?
If near Anglesey I might want to drop in later this month. 
I've never seen a coin shop in the UK other than in York city centre and their prices were way OTT.

It was at a flea market somewhere in the Brecon beacons.

They all seemed legit and I even got him to get some scales out and they were the right weight. 

Sadly I chickened out...at the time I had not actually seen a shieldback in the flesh and the deal seemed too good to be true...

Better safe than sorry, but also better than losing a £1000 buying a bunch of fake gold!

[Jay2]

On 12/09/2017 at 13:40, Pete said:

What kind of shop has sovereigns for sale ?

My local antiques shop has a few now and then, at flat rates of 250, and 125 on halves, seemingly regardless of dates. They also have random stacks of silver crowns dotted all around the glass cabinets with no apparent order to them. It's a quirky, messy place you could get lost treasure-hunting for hours in. Big cabinets full of silver items at the back, too.  

[Pete]

On 12/09/2017 at 16:13, BackyardBullion said:

It was at a flea market somewhere in the Brecon beacons.

They all seemed legit and I even got him to get some scales out and they were the right weight. 

Sadly I chickened out...at the time I had not actually seen a shieldback in the flesh and the deal seemed too good to be true...

Better safe than sorry, but also better than losing a £1000 buying a bunch of fake gold!

I would have done the same and walked away as you would never find the seller again if they turned out to be fakes.
Let someone else take the chance and maybe get a bargain but you can sleep easy.

[TheGoldSovereign]

On 14/09/2017 at 12:09, Pete said:

I would have done the same and walked away as you would never find the seller again if they turned out to be fakes.
Let someone else take the chance and maybe get a bargain but you can sleep easy.

After staring at nearly 1000 of sovereigns in depth i'm 99.9% sure i would know a fake now, I would love the opportunity to find some at a boot fair etc, no luck as of yet!

protip, if you are hunting in these kinds of places, take your loupe!

 

[Goldhooked]

On 10/09/2017 at 13:46, Pete said:

Your weights fall well inside the tolerances for full sovereigns that have been in circulation.
The specified weight is 7.988 for an uncirculated coin and you may find coins over 8.0g
With wear and tear you will typically loose about 0.5-0.75% so down to about 7.93 g.

Provided the weights are in range - which yours are - and they are the correct diameter then the giveaway of a fake is it will be noticeably thicker.
Don't immediately panic if you are comparing just the rims as some coins have protruding rims or less wear on the edges.
 

I've got a 1925 that weighs in at 8.04 so is that likely to be uncirculated?

[darrol]

46 minutes ago, Goldhooked said:

I've got a 1925 that weighs in at 8.04 so is that likely to be uncirculated?

Sounds on the heavy side to me ! Anything over 8.0g needs checking .

[Goldhooked]

Just now, darrol said:

Sounds on the heavy side to me ! Anything over 8.0g needs checking .

I got it from Atkinsons!!  You'd kind of hope they were only selling the real thing.

[darrol]

Just now, Goldhooked said:

I got it from Atkinsons!!  You'd kind of hope they were only selling the real thing.

well it sounds like your scales are wrong I have some full sovereigns  from Atkinsons all under 8.0g  , I guess its possible that some coins can be over 8.0g its just best to check .

[Goldhooked]

Just now, darrol said:

well it sounds like your scales are wrong I have some full sovereigns  from Atkinsons all under 8.0g  , I guess its possible that some coins can be over 8.0g its just best to check .

I got 2 sovs from them at the same time. 1 weighs under 8g and the other one 8.04g.  I just got a new set of scales with a 100g calibration weight but I guess it could still be wrong at the fractions of a gram?

[Murph]

Try weighing it around 10 times,switching your scales off for a minute or so in between and maybe even on different tables/surfaces.  That should give you an idea as to how likely your scales are to have measured the weight wrongly.

[Goldhooked]

2 hours ago, Murph said:

Try weighing it around 10 times,switching your scales off for a minute or so in between and maybe even on different tables/surfaces.  That should give you an idea as to how likely your scales are to have measured the weight wrongly.

Good idea.  I'll give that a try and report back.

[BackyardBullion]

 

[Gorseinonboy]

Very useful for a complete novice. I'm sure I am making the odd mistake on EBay just now.....but then it is part of a learning curve....

[Goldhooked]

On 19/09/2017 at 14:19, Murph said:

Try weighing it around 10 times,switching your scales off for a minute or so in between and maybe even on different tables/surfaces.  That should give you an idea as to how likely your scales are to have measured the weight wrongly.

Did several weighs in several places and the 1925 weighed 7.99 at the lowest and 8.04 highest, so I accept my scales are not very accurate.  However the 1925 consistently weighed 0.05 more than the 1911 I have.  Again this could be a failing of my scales.  With a ping test both sound the same and they are the same size.

[Murph]

Given the difference stayed the same I guess one will be more worn than the other and the heavier one must be full weight or very near.  I don't think you have anything to worry about and will just have to do multiple weighings and average the results if you are worried about other coins in future.