What % of your stack should be bullion?

[Lea79]

Hi guys ?

Ive been evaluating my stack and have realised over half its monetary value is in collectible coins. Its made me question my buying/exit strategy.

 When the time comes to sell my gold, I'd like to do it as quickly and as effort free as possible.  Thus, I have come to the conclusion that good portion of it should be bullion for easy exiting.

The only problem I have with this is I love collectible coins.  Bullion can be so boring!! Even so I'm going to focus on bullion for a while to swing the balance slightly.

What do you guys think? Do you think over 50% of your stack should be in bullion? Or do you have most of it in collectible coins?  I'm interested to see how the majority of people devide their stacks.  And how they control the collectible erge for gold haha. 

[fehk2001]

Gold cheap buy bullion 

gold expensive buy collectibles 

Gold too expensive sell bullion 

thanks for the cup noodles

 

[Lea79]

2 minutes ago, fehk2001 said:

Gold cheap buy bullion 

gold expensive buy collectibles 

Gold too expensive sell bullion 

thanks for the cup noodles

 

Nice little poem there fehk haha ?

[fehk2001]

13 minutes ago, Lea79 said:

Nice little poem there fehk haha ?

mum always likes poem 

telling me same thing everyday !

they are annoying 

 

[Kman]

This is something I've thought about too

None of my gold is pure bullion atm. I have stuff like 2002/5 sovereigns (or the 2017 indian sov I got recently) which are the closest, but they still have a premium over spot. 

I think the thing is for me, I can't imagine selling it all off in one go, more likely individual bits and bobs at a time, so it wont be too much of a hassle. 

If you think you might like/need to offload a big bulk at some point, yes maybe holding a certain % in pure bullion would be easier for you. 

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

It's 100% bullion for me. 

[Pipers]

Are you a collector or are you investing or both?  for me i buy bullion and pick up interesting coins on the way for example i have Italian Lire bought at 3% above spot they are all bullion and not worth more but they are interesting coins.  

 

[Lea79]

 I think I'm both a collector and a stacker.  I just seemed to have been more occupied with collectible coins this yr so my % has gone way up.

my stack is split into 3.  Bullion, semi numi and collectibles.  ATM I'm at 28% bullion, 21% semi numi and 51% collectables.  I'd like the collectibles and the bullion percentage the other way around.

I hope I never ever have to sell my stack and I can hand it down to my child, but I would also like some of it to be an emergency fund.  You never know what could happen.  The security of having a good whack of bullion you can send to a dealer and get say 10 grand pretty quickly is comforting.  

@Kman I put the 2002/2005/2012 sovs in the semi numi pile as they are worth a little over spot.  I also put in shield sovs and nepoleon Bonaparte 20 francs in as these are worth the same. Collectibles to me are proof coins and graded coins.

 

[Agpanda]

I have been thinkin the same, as I´m in 100% to pandas

Both silver and gold

I am planing to get me some bullion gold to have if I need fast cash some day

[Lea79]

As a forum member I would advise new stackers to think about they're exit plan then decide what to buy.  As a collector I want the nxt expensive, rare addition to add to my super duper box of shiny loveliness.  

Re-evaluating my stack now and again is a good thing.  Maybe I'll take some of my own advice haha.

 

ps.... 10 points if any1 picked up the twin town reference ?.

[fehk2001]

22 minutes ago, Lea79 said:

As a forum member I would advise new stackers to think about they're exit plan then decide what to buy.  As a collector I want the nxt expensive, rare addition to add to my super duper box of shiny loveliness.  

Re-evaluating my stack now and again is a good thing.  Maybe I'll take some of my own advice haha.

 

ps.... 10 points if any1 picked up the twin town reference ?.

My exit plan is :

hello my dear family members  , whatever I purchase are all yours when I die 

amen 

 

[oliversw5]

Ill throw my hat into the ring. 

Have you ever considered hat you can use collectors premium to trade for more bullion further down the line. 

I shall add, I recently acquired two tubes of 1/4 Gairsoppa coins fully sealed from a guy in Germany. very specialist coins, I won't say what I paid for them. However before they had even landed I had traded a tube with a gentleman I know who collects interesting coins, especially shipwreck coins. 

Maybe you are looking at the problem the wrong way. I propose that the question instead should be: Do you have a list of contacts that allows you to hold little bullion? 

By reaching out and having a vast amount of contacts you can avoid the fees of eBay which is where most collectible coins probably are sold if they are lowish value coins. On a personal note I have no problems doing trades across countries, I have found that coins have different premiums in different parts of the world. For anyone who is a bit savvy with numbers they can venture out and trade a collectible coin that can be more sought after in another part of the world, sometimes you get a double whammy of the currency going in your favour. So I think its correct to think about exit strategy but you need to change your mindset. If you like the idea of connecting with more people then hold more premium coins, if that is not for you and its just a private hobby you wish to pursue then hold more bullion as the exit will be less messy.

[KevjustKev]

4 hours ago, fehk2001 said:

My exit plan is :

hello my dear family members  , whatever I purchase are all yours when I die 

amen 

 

Careful what you wish for.

[Lea79]

1 hour ago, oliversw5 said:

Ill throw my hat into the ring. 

Have you ever considered hat you can use collectors premium to trade for more bullion further down the line. 

I shall add, I recently acquired two tubes of 1/4 Gairsoppa coins fully sealed from a guy in Germany. very specialist coins, I won't say what I paid for them. However before they had even landed I had traded a tube with a gentleman I know who collects interesting coins, especially shipwreck coins. 

Maybe you are looking at the problem the wrong way. I propose that the question instead should be: Do you have a list of contacts that allows you to hold little bullion? 

By reaching out and having a vast amount of contacts you can avoid the fees of eBay which is where most collectible coins probably are sold if they are lowish value coins. On a personal note I have no problems doing trades across countries, I have found that coins have different premiums in different parts of the world. For anyone who is a bit savvy with numbers they can venture out and trade a collectible coin that can be more sought after in another part of the world, sometimes you get a double whammy of the currency going in your favour. So I think its correct to think about exit strategy but you need to change your mindset. If you like the idea of connecting with more people then hold more premium coins, if that is not for you and its just a private hobby you wish to pursue then hold more bullion as the exit will be less messy.

 Making lots of contacts across the numismatic world is not for me.  As much as I love chatting with people about different coins, I haven't really got the time to be exploring it any further.  

I would consider selling abroad.  I can't say I've ever done it but if I was to get a better price, that wouldn't be a problem.

I am a private collector and as such probably need to add more bullion to ensure a proportionally trouble free exit.  I could trade down for more bullion, but I don't want to do that that just adds hassle and all the items I have in the colletion part of my stack I adore. 

Its my buying strategy that has prompted this evaluation.  It hasn't of late fitted my exit plan.  90% of the coins I've bought his year have been proofs.  Nxt yr it needs to be the other way around to strike some sort of balance.

 

 

[KDave]

I prefer bullion for the reasons outlined above. Privacy, liquidity and I have convinced myself the metals are cheap. The investment case for gold and silver is a completely different one to that of a proof coin with a special design on it, which also happens to be made from gold or silver or platinum. No guarantees in any case.

I see numismatics as a different market, one that is often fickle and seems to follow trends, some which have good track records, but that guarantees nothing. See US coins as a recent example. Equally there are many winners and fair play to those that spot them and know the markets to sell into. Who knows what will be wanted in the future? I have some collectors coins but my exposure is limited and most of them fall into the 'ill keep this one for a while, I like it' category rather than as an investment. I see it as risky over the long term to bank on rising premiums given past performance of collectables throughout history, but each to their own. 

In summary, its up to you what your goals are and how you intend to sell. Great point above about having contacts to sell to, I think if you have this network in place you get a much better feel for the market and can make better judgement calls on what to buy and when to sell.  

 

[Xander]

Hedge your bets with a bit of both. Collecting is more interesting though.

[Pampfan]

One option to consider if you have worries about an exit strategy or needing fast liquid assets in case of an emergency is simply to have a cash reserve of say 20% of the total stack value - this will allow you to handle small "bumps" when quick cash is needed and affords you some time to sell off the numismatic items - which probably  will take longer to sell.

My collection is 80% bullion and 20% numismatic, and 80% gold and 20% silver. It just so turns out that what I collect and love to stack is bullion pamp suisse gold and silver bars.  The gold bars are bullion - but the silver bars all have high premiums - so I consider them "numismatic." I have a spreadsheet of my stack and I made a page of stack liquidity - listing the entire stack with 3 levels  of sellability in case it needs to be liquidated.

Level 1 - are the bullion bars and are the first to go (consisting of gold bars that will be easily sold at spot). 

Level 2 - are the "numismatic" bars - ones with high premiums - that will need some time to sell.

 Level 3 - are the real numismatic coins (like my 2014 1/4 oz gold pf70 libertad) - these will take longer to sell to get my asking price.

The last step is to look at the spreadsheet and determine how comfortable you are in each level and then adjust your stack accordingly.

Or you can simply just sell everything and not have to worry about it. 

 

[metallica73]

Fair play to those that do, but I'd just get bored stacking the one coin over and over... as mentioned above I think a little % should always be there that can easily be shifted should the need arise.

[Roy]

Great question Lea79

If 28% of your stack is simple bullion, I hope that would be enough to cover any small emergencies?

If something really catastrophic were to happen, I'd have no problem selling all my stack to HGM and taking the hit. It's insurance after all, that's its job.

If you feel that you'd like more bullion however, go for it, we know it makes sense 

I also agree with Pampfan, it doesn't hurt to hold some cash. There's nothing more liquid, it's easy to store and doesn't require internet access 

[fehk2001]

5 hours ago, tallthinkev said:

Careful what you wish for.

Un death is more sad , you will see everyone goes before you do 

[Augustus1]

being new to PM I cant offer any advice to lea79 as I am fumbling around a bit at this moment in time myself , but being here and reading threads like this with far more experienced stackers/ collector's like you guys all help greatly to clarify the direction & what strategy suits my situation whilst adding PM to my overall wealth and all my other diversified investments, savings , pensions etc , I will have to sit down and calculate what percentages of coins, gold , silver I have to define where I need to go as all I have done so far is buy what I like  also most of my PM is inherited at this stage  .suppose my general advice is diversify in every thing you have .

dean.m

[4Nines7Hills]

  it depends on your definition of collector coins but

 I only buy bullion and semi numismatics i dont buy true collector coins as they are far harder to sell and some don't even make the money. This is true for Gold and silver

[Lea79]

Thanks for your responses guys ?.  It's good to know I'm not the only 1 who has been thinking about this.  I think I just need some discipline to hold back on the proofs for a while and focus more on bullion. Throw in a semi numi once in a while to keep me interested. 

[fehk2001]

2 minutes ago, Lea79 said:

Thanks for your responses guys ?.  It's good to know I'm not the only 1 who has been thinking about this.  I think I just need some discipline to hold back on the proofs for a while and focus more on bullion. Throw in a semi numi once in a while to keep me interested. 

yea yea yea , just more excuse to spend more  money  

[mongo28]

When it comes to liquidity, nothing beats gold bullion, so whatever is cheaper based on where you live is what you should stack.

In the USA it's Gold/Silver Eagles, fractional of 1/10, 1/4 and 1/2 will move immediately as the pool of buyers is in the millions...

For the UK and Europe it's whatever you can buy that avoids VAT and other taxes... So the UK it's Sovereigns or Queens Beasts, etc... The rest of Europe it's Philharmonic, etc...

I started out 80% silver vs 20% gold... Mostly numistmatics and now I'm working towards 80% gold vs 20% silver...

I still have the majority of my stack in NGC or PCGS numismatic gold/silver... But it's rare or highly sought after coins. The remaining 20% bullion is highly liquid gold/silver that I can flip when the spot price increases.

So the question to ask yourself is are you a "collector", "stacker" or combination of both? The answer is always evolving and changing based on your personal experiences...

Either way this is a good hobby that acts like a 2nd or 3rd savings account... So save for the future and keep smiling!