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JSILVER

Where can Silver and Gold go?

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Hi everyone, I am just wondering where everyone believes silver and gold can go?
I have invested in both metals and I am very much in this for the long haul.
I do believe both metals will go up in price and I very much believe silver is highly undervalued as do many but my question is how much can it go up?
Current fix on Silver is around £14.43oz and Gold at £987.39oz

I for one can see silver moving up into or over £20 an ounce. 
Gold on the other hand I believe will struggle to break £1050, unless real instability happens in the world.

I am just really interested in everyone's views, lets say within the next 2 years so by the end of 2018, where will gold and silver be?

I look forward to your reply's.

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The only way gold and silver will go up is if the economy collapses and we have a gold backed currency..I've been waiting for this to happen since 2012 listening to all the shills bullshit so we buy more silver...Bullion is a waste of time in my opinion.. That's why I stopped buying standard bullion coins and turned to proof coins with low Mintage..In 2012 I was paying nearly £30 a Oz for a standard bullion coin now 6 years later it's worth £15...Were as my zues coin for instance I bought for £90 and now it's worth £500+

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I understand what you saying but I do believe there is only so much gold and silver in the world and mining is very expensive.
I don't think it will go to the moon as they say but movement into the 20's for silver I don't think is that impossible.
Gold on the other hand, I think will stay as is unless like you say any instability happens. It would be nice to see it fall back down to £700 like just over a year ago, would be a great buying opportunity!
 

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The reasons that pushed gold and silver to their highs of 2011 have not changed at all, they have not gone away, been solved

  • Debts are bigger, much bigger
  • Euro is further towards disintegration,
  • Brexit had not even been suggested in 2011,
  • The PIGS of Europe still in the chit, and nothing solved since the 2008 
  • Dutch looking to exit euro, France  looking to exit euro,
  • Greece announcing it may use US $ dollar as currency leave euro,
  • Russia, China, India still buying mega amounts of gold annually
  • Demonising and prodding the Russian bear daily into another world conflict
  • Further steps towards a cashless society
  • Removal of high end Indian currency notes overnight announced
  • Bail in trailed in Cypress bail outs done and now implemented and written into law of most western countries.  The money in your bank just makes you an unsecured creditor, the money is not yours when deposited
  • Negative interest rates weren't heard of in 2011 
  • Real hyper inflation playing out in realtime in Venezulua
  • Personal debt in the UK at the same as 2008 levels, housing market still due a massive correction
  • As Roy said the other day, 9 out of 10 new cars bought on contract hire
  • Look at the state of your local high street, can anyone say the economy is really thriving ??
  • Bank throwing loans at near zero percent
  • and a trigger happy rug wearing wall building megalomaniac TV star in charge of the nuclear codes

Do you want to be at this financial game of musical chairs when the music final stops and you don't have a chair ??

Just the very fact of holding silver/gold regardless of price gives you an invisible protection you have some cover should the wheels come off this bus any time soon. 

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There is no right answer - it will go up or it can also go down.
Like a few other "oldies" on this forum I piled into silver bullion as it rose & rose & rose in value topping £30 per ounce.
It was heading "to the moon" so to speak and plenty of experts predicting eye-watering prices as the world woke up to holding PMs.
If you have ever seen hungry fish in a lake turn the water into a boiling mass then that's what is was like with silver coins a few years back.


Forecasting the future is best done using tea-leaves in the bottom of a cup.


There are many publications on investing in PMs and many so called financial experts but the ones that were bullish and top of their game a few years ago are hiding somewhere today.
Because silver is relatively cheap at present I personally see silver as a worthwhile investment for the future but where is the red line that determines when silver becomes expensive ? If we ever see spot near £30 then I will be unloading and buying shares & funds rather than metals with the fiat.

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I think a lot of people have their heads in the clouds concerning precious metals and particularly gold and silver (you don't hear many people ramping up the other metals so much). It will never go to the moon and what does that even mean anyway? are we talking 100% or 1000%. Do people have end plan, some people on here do, but Ive often bought from other people who are shocked at how little I offer because they price their coins wrong.

In my mind gold and silver offer different functions; yes they both cover counter-party risk but gold is the store of wealth and silver is its volatile little brother that I believe has more opportunities due to the collectibility of some coins. If you are buying just to store your wealth then silver is not your friend. You should buy as much as you can afford in gold as often as possible and you should be able to sell it in one go and have the same purchasing power, it shouldn't be treated as an investment class. It has the functions and characteristics as an insurance policy. If you are buying PM in order to profit then silver has tremendous upside if you know what you are doing and have the contacts in place. So the natural direction is from stacker to collector to flipper and those who are super successful dealer. For me this is fundamentally important to realise, you go from having a goal of making x percent to realising that as a flipper or a dealer you are essentially an entrepreneur and you will lower your expectations of what percentage you want to earn. A stacker has an end goal where a flipper and dealer will reinvest proceeds along the way. I am not saying one option is better than the other BUT to simply say its going to the moon is flawed and goes against the fundamentals of mathematics and the value of time money and also compound interest. Gold solves the problem of time value of money. Silver finds a solution (if done properly) for compound interest.

As for why you should buy into gold or silver (as there are many other asset classes also that could provide the function of gold or silver). I am going to be controversial and simply say bullocks to most of the points Paul raised (I have a lot of respect for Paul, make no mistake) lets make it simpler. Say you have 2 pies, cash is one pie and PMs are another pie. Lets say that a unit of money is a person and a unit of Pm's is also a person. Everytime a unit is added the pie gets smaller for you because someone else wants a slice. the question is simple, do you believe that the units of money will grow faster than the units of PMs? Thats very simple, lets add another dimension to it, imagine that you are in a canteen with these two pies and you have blue collar workers (money units) and white collar workers(PMs) coming in and out, and the canteen is in a constant state of flux. your slice of the pie is constantly changing but the likely hood is there are more unskilled workers than skilled workers, if you was to hold money the chances are your pie would be less in the long run. Now lets imagine for a second the canteen is actually in a bank and they have the ability the hire as many blue collar workers as imaginable but they have no control over hiring white collar workers because they are outsourced by a private company. As an individual you would maximise your needs and choose the pie for the white collar workers because its worth more to your utility than the pie for blue collar works. This is essentially how precious metals work at its most basic form.  

As for Petes comment about tea leaves I simply don't agree with that, I have worked for/with people who have made millions forecasting because they are smart enough to exploit changes in the market. There is no such thing as an end game and to treat a forecast as so means you are not getting the best out of it. A lot of the gurus have a one sided agenda, forecasting should at least have various scenarios.

Just my ideas. you are welcome to cut them up and put them in the bin.  

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It's all about the end plan! Some clever observations Shaun :)

What bothers me about silver is why is nobody buying it?

Recently, there has been some very cheap silver on here and it has stalled. Danny is offering an incredible deal! Less than spot + VAT. 

Will it still be here tomorrow? Where are the 'I've got £10,000 to spend on silver' boys now eh? *I stand corrected!

If you had bought at £30/oz it would lower your average considerably.

Edited by Roy

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i constantly follow the spot and futures prices of precious metals. 

Price is generally measured in USD and through the dollar, other currencies. These fiat currencies are debt based. These currencies are borrowed into existence. Nothing but confidence and our labour actually backs them. When you take a 'loan' out at the bank, the bank does not have the currency. Your signature on the form, the credit card slip or whatever causes the currency to come into existence. 

Such a system is fundamentally doomed. There is never enough currency to repay the 'loan' and the interest. America has been as successful as it has by exporting its debt (US dollars) in return for tangible goods. This simply passes the book and when others stop accepting the dollar, all the debt dollars will return to the US, increasing the money supply and causing inflation. 

Gold and silver are real money. They trade as half of currency pairs on the Forex markets. This is why there is so much interest in gold and silver compared with other metals. Governments manage their currency and so everyone is interested in managing the price of gold and silver. 

Gold and silver are finite. Central banks and other 'lenders' can and are creating vast amounts of currency. Most of this currency has stayed within the banking system to fuel the bond and stock markets but nevertheless the perceived value of the currency continues to be eroded and evermore is created. The suppression of the fiat currency denominated value of gold and silver can go on for as long as there is cheap gold and silver available for physical buyers. Much of the gold and silver has gone to Asia. The cheap gold and silver are running out. Once the demand exceeds the supply of cheap metal the price will really take off. Price will take off, it is inevitable b/c the collapse of fiat currency systems is inevitable. Every debt based currency collapses b/c there is never enough currency to pay off the debt with interest. 

No-one knows what the eventual price of gold and silver [real money] will be. It depends how gold and silver figure in future currency systems. If currencies were to be fully back by gold, then the price of gold would need to be much higher and this is where numbers like $50 000 come from.

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Its all about the end plan. Agreed. It comes down to your personal circumstances, some people want it to go in one which is my philosophy on bullion gold  and that is stacker mentality. Some people will devote the time to by and sell, yes its more effort but you should be compensated if you are prudent and good at what you do.

Personally I don't think the forum is effective at selling, Ive spoke to a few people about it. I rarely list stuff on here these days because unless I am listing it at rock bottom prices I know it probably won't move. I can get more of a return selling through other mediums. 

On a personal note, I will be buying up to a 1000 ounces of silver because I think the EU will fail, but my circumstances are different because of my age and Ive got no outgoings etc etc. Would it be wise for someone to aim for something along those lines with different circumstances, probably not. The coins I am backing are pandas and Brits with a small lot of other stuff and I have been rolling it over consistently to fund my warchest.

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4 hours ago, JSILVER said:

Gold on the other hand I believe will struggle to break £1050, unless real instability happens in the world.

It was down to about £700 in November 2015, £880 30th January then by September 2016 almost £1050; 35% upswing in a year and that was fairly recently

 

 

 

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13 hours ago, Kman said:

It was down to about £700 in November 2015, £880 30th January then by September 2016 almost £1050; 35% upswing in a year and that was fairly recently

 

 

 

I remember the 700. I was going to buy but didn't have the nerve. Since then I have only got a small amount as I'm hoping it goes back to 700, which now I believe is less likely then ever... What I meant about 1050 is it going over that by any meaningful stretch would be because of turmoil in the markets.

Edited by JSILVER

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