1/4 ounce gold queens beast

[Pampfan]

Just wanted to know if anyone in the forum has sent this coin in to be graded.  I bought 2 of them and under close scrutiny saw they were not perfect but I sent them to ngc to be graded anyway. 

Yesterday I was searching online and saw that paradise mint had about 40 of them graded pcgs ms69 for $379 each and 20 graded ms70 for $469.  Today when I checked, all the ms70 were sold.

So probably it wasn't such a good idea to send the two I had in to be graded when I could have bought a ms69 for only a few bucks more.

Anyway, has anyone in the U.K. Seen an ms70.

[Guest]

Sent one to be graded for myself and got a 69. Amazed 20 reached 70 as it took RMB 4 goes to get me a 69


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[happy2gether]

I was attempted to buy one from Paradise Mint, but I had a look on google what people say about this company.   And Paradise would send to US addresses only.

PCGS database says that there are only 13 MS70 and 63 MS69. NGC graded coins are rare (only 4 MS70 and 12 MS69) and strange that people would pay more for NGC graded version also for the 2oz silver Lion. MCM sold the first ever 4 NGC MS70 in less than half day and 6 NGC MS69 at once today. Seems it was not easy for MCM either to find good pieces for grading. 

@Pampfan congratulation for finding a MS70 1/4 Beast. 

[Pampfan]

Thanks

all the condition problems discussed on the forum stuck in my head so when it came up to buy I just jumped on it. 

I really hate all the problems that collectors in GB have in getting GB coins only available in the US

it will be interesting to see if they continue with the 1/4 ounce size

 

 

[Pampfan]

Just received the grades from ngc for the two queens beast 1/4 gold I sent in.  Very pleased with both getting an ms69.  I thought they would not grade that high. Will post pictures ounce I receive back the package.

[Oldun]

Hmmm. 5 ngc ms70s and 13 pcgs ms70s currently on their registry as of five minutes ago, so I would love to know where the 20 ms70s come from that you referred to as Paradise Mint having on your mail of September 21st? Does that mean they had all 18 plus two that have not shown up on either registry? Or are a part of or all 20 registered with a different grading company ? Too many questions, not enough answers.

[motorbikez]

58 minutes ago, Oldun said:

Hmmm. 5 ngc ms70s and 13 pcgs ms70s currently on their registry as of five minutes ago, so I would love to know where the 20 ms70s come from that you referred to as Paradise Mint having on your mail of September 21st? Does that mean they had all 18 plus two that have not shown up on either registry? Or are a part of or all 20 registered with a different grading company ? Too many questions, not enough answers.

The US has loads of grading companies the main ones & most reputable are NGC,PCGS & ANACS. so the 20 could be spread amongst all grading Co's ,also just a thought of mine how often/when do grading companies update their data bases.

[Oldun]

It would be great if the original poster could confirm this from his recollection of visiting the website he mentioned.  ANACS dont seem to provide a view of their registry upon a cursory check. Does anyone have access ?

 

 Ngs an Pcgs update daily and post it on the relevant page fyi.

 

I may seem a little detailed and fussy right now but this time next year, it may well be really important price wise to know how many ms70s are out there for the 1/4s and to be able to keep track of them going forward and as a first of series (and possibly only of type if they cease production entirely of the 1/4 bu version of all 10 designs).

[Pampfan]

When I looked at the paradisemint website when I ordered my cointhey stated they had 20 in stock.  That was my reference for the post. Could be that they made an error on their inventory system. The next day they were no longer available. 

If pcgs says they only graded 13 ms70 - then that must be the number I would go with. 

In time more people may send them in to be graded and some more 70's may pop up.

 

 

[happy2gether]

As mentioned before MCM sold the first 4 NGC MS70 pieces.
Now NGC has pop of 8 in their database.


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[Clens92]

I have seen an NGC MS70 Queen's Beast floating about on Facebook.  Mightily impressive.

[happy2gether]

Wow. Someone or more a dealer could grade another 16 pieces MS70 beast. Total pop of 24 for NGC now.


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[Guest]

Wow. Someone or more a dealer could grade another 16 pieces MS70 beast. Total pop of 24 for NGC now.


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Kind of inevitable but it does beg the question on how lots of good condition beasts went to America and the rejects were sent to the uk in the first place. I can't say that I am surprised


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[TheGoldSovereign]

Corruption is rife throughout society, wouldn't be surprised at all if it exists in these grading bodies and dealers.

[happy2gether]

Kind of inevitable but it does beg the question on how lots of good condition beasts went to America and the rejects were sent to the uk in the first place. I can't say that I am surprised

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For me it's strange because it took long for few perfect pieces in the database and then suddenly 16 more perfect graded beasts. Only a dealer with lots of beasts can sort out perfect pieces. The number of MS69 pieces has increased by only about 10. Hopefully I have the chance to spot the new graded pieces and can compare the quality. I have a NGC MS70 and a PCGS MS69.

[Guest]

Maybe a dealer like pinehurst graded them? Maybe they sent 100 and asked for 70 only grades?


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[Pipers]

IMO, This is the kind of thing that happens over and over through out the years. Regarding the 1/4 oz Beast,  I have watched and read over the months members of the forum and youtube members buying inspecting sending coins back to the RM repeatedly,  then sending Beasts off to be graded or just wanting a coin without scratches on the coin. The time spent by members must of be in the many hours.   

If the RM are doing deals with American dealers for the best coins then the UK buyers should be made aware of this and the inferior coins (the one with scratches and faults) be sold as scrap bullion 3% above spot.   

[BaldyBob]

27 minutes ago, Pipers said:

sold as scrap bullion 3% above spot.   

Only a matter of time before they turn up at HGM, and shock/horror, I will bang them in a tube with the other 1/4's

[Guest]

The number of 70's is still low.

Maybe a few more will be graded it's entirely possible. The key issue in the uk is not the 1/4 beast etc or the spot price but the exchange rate.

Imho buying sovereigns in bulk or any non numismatic gold right now is a very risky business that almost guarantees losses. It would take a RiSE of 25% in the spot price to recover from the exchange loss looking forward 2 years or so.


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[Oldun]

Take a look at the gold price in yen if you really want to see what happens.

http://thesilverforum.com/charts/

 

In dollars, just look at this chart and it smacks you straight in the face when the right time to buy and sell happened (in usd anyway).

 

[Pipers]

14 minutes ago, Numistacker said:

The number of 70's is still low.

Maybe a few more will be graded it's entirely possible. The key issue in the uk is not the 1/4 beast etc or the spot price but the exchange rate.

Imho buying sovereigns in bulk or any non numismatic gold right now is a very risky business that almost guarantees losses. It would take a RiSE of 25% in the spot price to recover from the exchange loss looking forward 2 years or so.


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Hi Numi, You maybe right and the £ is very low against the $ and thats why many people put their money into USD or bought FTSE companies with USD exposure eg commodities , there was a thread running before brexit on oil and the $ I think quite a few took advantage.  

Buying Gold is a part of my balanced portfolio means profits should be balanced so buying on dips even though the price is high makes sense to me.  I do not want to hold the £ at the moment,  Gold bullion can be sold easily and fast, Its the best insurance in the UK  right now and bullion coins is just my choice. When the £ makes a sound bottom or it looks like the $ is being devalued I will look to buy back into the £, IMO we will have to wait until 2017 mid April to see what the banks have decided to do.

I have other coins for a collection point of view, this is a hobby not part of an investment , so my Perth mint silver coins, Libertads/mexican coins, Pandas Proof Sovereigns, war time coins, ETC are not an investment.      

[Pipers]

18 minutes ago, Oldun said:

Take a look at the gold price in yen if you really want to see what happens.

http://thesilverforum.com/charts/

 

In dollars, just look at this chart and it smacks you straight in the face when the right time to buy and sell happened (in usd anyway).

 

I was thinking just after the USA election, though the chart suggests late October!   I see what you mean by the price of Gold in JYN, maybe thats why sales of Gold to Japan have gone up. 

[breaktwister]

I am a new stacker and the thought of getting in at the start of a series is tempting.  But should I wait for the rumored proofs and can anyone tell me or guess what the pros/cons are and what impact the proofs might have on the premium on the existing coins?

[happy2gether]

I think nobody can tell what might happen. As you already mentioned they are rumors. One rumor is that the next beast will be released soon (November?). Another is that the Royal Mint is stopping to release a 1/4 oz version again.
In my opinion if you can get the first beast near the price of other bullion coins then you do nothing wrong. Great if you know someone in the US. Still cheapest offer on ebay is from pinehurstcoins with about 349 USD incl. domestic shipping. Otherwise for non-US buyer ebay charges shipping and taxes, and that's stupid because this coin should be tax-exempt.


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[Noobstacker86]

Im kinda in the same boat as you Breaktwister i would like a 1/4oz queens beast but don't no if to wait for the rumored proofs or not.
according to the proclamation i read, the Royal mint will be issuing the new queens beast in a 1oz, 1/4oz and a 1/10oz gold coin as well as the 2oz silver