PAMP 1g bar real or not?

[GoldElliott]

Hi guys,

I have never owned any gold bars at all and so it is all new to me

I have been given a 1g gold PAMP bar, however I want to know how to tell if it is genuine. Not sure if they fake the 1g bars, however I know the larger ones are often faked.

The only reason I am asking is that there is no letter before the certificate number and I believe they usually have letters a, b or c before the number.

Also, the bar seems very loose in the clear plastic and moves a lot, but not sure if this is normal as I have never owned one.

Please see the photos below and any advice or help would be great as I really don't know anything on bars!

Thanks

[StackSellRepeat]

Elliott it’s hard to confirm the authenticity from a picture, especially on products that are getting faked better every year.

 

From the eye nothing sticks out & looks genuine (My option) but you’d have to get it checked out, XRF (Scanning device) would be the best option as you wouldn’t need to remove it from the packaging, Should be free to get checked out at your local dealers.

[Xander]

1 hour ago, elliotthuntt said:

Hi guys,

I have never owned any gold bars at all and so it is all new to me

I have been given a 1g gold PAMP bar, however I want to know how to tell if it is genuine. Not sure if they fake the 1g bars, however I know the larger ones are often faked.

The only reason I am asking is that there is no letter before the certificate number and I believe they usually have letters a, b or c before the number.

Also, the bar seems very loose in the clear plastic and moves a lot, but not sure if this is normal as I have never owned one.

Please see the photos below and any advice or help would be great as I really don't know anything on bars!

Thanks

Maybe this is worth a watch

 

[Tn21]

@Pampfan

What do you reckon sir ?

[Pampfan]

From the pictures it looks good to me. 
Some advise - Always dble check everything yourself -  the local pawn shop or coin shop should be able to verify it.

some info - 1) it shakes in the holder because it is so tiny. 2) letters before the number are later year production of the bars.

after you check it out let us know.

 

[Melon]

19 minutes ago, Pampfan said:

From the pictures it looks good to me. 
Some advise - Always dble check everything yourself -  the local pawn shop or coin shop should be able to verify it.

some info - 1) it shakes in the holder because it is so tiny. 2) letters before the number are later year production of the bars.

after you check it out let us know.

 Dropping hot knowledge bombs 👍

[CadmiumGreen]

Just now, Melon said:

 Dropping hot knowledge bombs 👍

@Pampfan is truly dropping PAMP warheads on foreheads!

[jonrms]

I am VERY suspicious about this!!! 

 

Yes it could be a early version 

But the assayer is the same. Send it to someone who has a precious metal varifier

[GoldElliott]

9 hours ago, Xander said:

Maybe this is worth a watch

 

I

 

7 hours ago, Pampfan said:

From the pictures it looks good to me. 
Some advise - Always dble check everything yourself -  the local pawn shop or coin shop should be able to verify it.

some info - 1) it shakes in the holder because it is so tiny. 2) letters before the number are later year production of the bars.

after you check it out let us know.

 

Thanks for the help guys!

 

Still doesn't seem to be any explanation for why there is no letter before the certificate number! If you know anyone on here with a pmv who would be willing to test it for me (For a fee obviously) I'd be grateful if you can tag them please, think I'll just post it to someone to verify!

Thanks

[StackSellRepeat]

55 minutes ago, elliotthuntt said:

I

 

Thanks for the help guys!

 

Still doesn't seem to be any explanation for why there is no letter before the certificate number! If you know anyone on here with a pmv who would be willing to test it for me (For a fee obviously) I'd be grateful if you can tag them please, think I'll just post it to someone to verify!

Thanks

It’s an older variation, Probably from before 2010  

 

All the ones after 2015 (I believe) have a alphabet prefix started with A etc... 👍

[GoldElliott]

13 minutes ago, StackSellRepeat said:

It’s an older variation, Probably from before 2010  

 

All the ones after 2015 (I believe) have a alphabet prefix started with A etc... 👍

Thanks, so any pre-2015 don't have letters? There isn't a huge amount on info about the certificate number online!

[StackSellRepeat]

1 minute ago, elliotthuntt said:

Thanks, so any pre-2015 don't have letters? There isn't a huge amount on info about the certificate number online!

I could be possibly wrong on my dates, but yes that’s correct before the alphabetical prefix SN they where all numbered digit SNs.

 

you won’t find much info on serial numbers etc most firms keep that hush hush.

[StackSellRepeat]

Check this out https://www.goldbarren-wiki.de/pamp-suisse-goldbarren.html

 

Next best thing to estimated dates of mintage etc...

 

 

[jonrms]

I have bought silver before that didn't have a letter, it WAS fake. I didn't show off all the processes I went through but alot of controversy was on that video. It was a fake and was crumbling, I have cut ALOT of silver up and never had it crumble. 

I have pamp bars pre 2015 and ore 2010 that ALL have a letter, the newer ones have a scanner. I DO know some bars sent to America have no letter, but I have never handled one. You need a PMV as I said. Obviously I am sure you tried a neodidium magnet through the plastic.  

If not do that first. There should be ZERO attraction 

 

[Pampfan]

1 hour ago, jonrms said:

I have bought silver before that didn't have a letter, it WAS fake. I didn't show off all the processes I went through but alot of controversy was on that video. It was a fake and was crumbling, I have cut ALOT of silver up and never had it crumble. 

I have pamp bars pre 2015 and ore 2010 that ALL have a letter, the newer ones have a scanner. I DO know some bars sent to America have no letter, but I have never handled one. You need a PMV as I said. Obviously I am sure you tried a neodidium magnet through the plastic.  

If not do that first. There should be ZERO attraction 

 

was it a pamp silver bar that was fake or some other branded bar?

Pamp has continuously changed how they identify their bars over the years - earlier bars in the original blue assay had certificates on the assay but not on the bar itself. Earlier bars to that came with a certificate and where just in a clear plastic holder so the bars come in all forms over the years -  

Note - just because the bar has a stamped number Or motif on it doesn’t make it real or fake - all bars need to be tested to guarantee they are real.

that being said - from my experience of handling and seeing many real pamp suisse bars over the years - I think it is real. Their is nothing about the packaging or the bar itself that would indicate it as a fake. 

curious as to see what the results are of the tests.

 

[jonrms]

It's on my YouTube channel jonrms 

It's a old video and ALOT of people argued it's real, but it wasn't. For a start when or if you look at the silver bar in the packaging it crumbled when cut. Other packaging from the same year were not bubbled, the bar was a different size. The letters in PAMP were off. 

It was along time ago I did that but 1 thing is for certain,  it was fake. 

 

[Pampfan]

Do you still have that bar?

@jonrms it goes to show that there are fakes out there and - we all need to be educated and careful.

What metal do you think it was made out of?

[jonrms]

6 minutes ago, Pampfan said:

Do you still have that bar?

@jonrms it goes to show that there are fakes out there and - we all need to be educated and careful.

What metal do you think it was made out of?

Ot hand a unusual mix there was a tiny bit of tungston but I am sure there was tin as well. I used acids to test it at the time, but Silver doesn't crumble into powder.

[Pampfan]

Maybe it was rhodium?😉🤞🏻

[GoldElliott]

I will be taking it to HGM in a couple of days and will update on the result

I presume they will have an XRF scanner to test properly.

Thanks everyone for the help again

[GoldElliott]

Results are in........

 

Drumroll please......

 

 

It's real!

 

They said the slightly lower karat is due to the plastic, but both Baird and Co and Hatton Garden Metals confirmed its authenticity.

 

Thanks again everyone for the help! Researching and finding out if it's real has been great fun- and turns out it's just an older bar and the old serial numbering system.

 

[Melon]

11 hours ago, elliotthuntt said:

Results are in........

 

Drumroll please......

 

 

It's real!

 

They said the slightly lower karat is due to the plastic, but both Baird and Co and Hatton Garden Metals confirmed its authenticity.

 

Thanks again everyone for the help! Researching and finding out if it's real has been great fun- and turns out it's just an older bar and the old serial numbering system.

 

Cool!

That's an intense amount of testing to put a 1g bar through 😅

[GoldElliott]

11 hours ago, Melon said:

Cool!

That's an intense amount of testing to put a 1g bar through 😅

Person who bought it for me was concerned of authenticity and as I buy and sell on here and elsewhere I wanted to be 100000% sure so as to have peace of mind should I decide to part with it in future. Plus I work in Holborn so just popped into HGM and Baird as it's a 5 min walk

[Pampfan]

🍺 Cheers!

[Tn21]

Forever Pampfan 🤣