Baird Mint - Nightmare to deal with

[SendYourCoin2Me]

As the title suggests, what a shocking outfit to try and deal with.  Im possibly out of pocket £500, or over £6500, at this point i just dont know.

Last week on Thursday I placed an order at £6500+ and provided my ID because apparently to be their customer they want your ID.  They emailed the next day asking for proof of my address.  My driving license ID contains that address, but they wanted a 2nd item, a posted letter from a bank or uitility company.  As this is the 21st century thats all done online, so not really something im going to have.  I did however have the covering letter for my replacement bank card, so I sent that.  They rejected that as its not dated.  I advised them I dont have anything else thats been posted by a bankor utility company on Friday, (5 days ago) and suggested if they were unwilling or unable to fulfil my order they should cancel it and return my money.  I heard nothing back so I phoned them on Monday afternoon. I was told the (unspecified) person i needed to speak to wasnt in, but they would call me the next day.  No call was received dear reader.  I finally got an email on Wednesday saying that I cant cancel my order (im not cancelling, its them refusing to fulfil it) as they have already hedged my order when I placed it??? Im ordering PHYSICAL bullion here, not placing a market trade.  They can however, fulfil my order as a guest they now tell me.  So a week after I placed the order request, I can now pay, or can i?  I havent actually been sent an invoice or payment details, but fortunately i did get an automatic email from them with a final demand to pay the balance.  So I (grudgingly and very unwillingly) transferred the £6k+change balance online last night (wed 11th)  I also emailed to complain about this ridiculous set of hoops which when i said i couldnt pay, mysteriously vanished.

So, why am I so angry at 1am today?  I just received another automatic email, this time telling me my order has been cancelled and deposit forfeit as i havent paid.  Its literally been about 40 mins since i paid them.  Im hoping its just crossed in the post, but from the treatment ive had so far, i wouldnt be surprised if they have a policy of not correcting this mistake of theirs unless the buyer can demonstrate 5 ball juggling while doing a handstand on a flaming highwire.

What a joke folks, honestly, i highly recommend sticking with the European Mint, Harrington & Byrne, The Gold Bullion Co, Royal Mint, goldsilver.be, BackYardBullion or from forum members on here.  Ive bought thousands of pounds of gold and silver between all of the above, and even organised a few group buys for friends from goldsilver.be and every one has been flawlessly executed by every seller.  We are talking about almost £20k a year ive spent  between me and my friends, without a single hitch and zero stress.

I almost didnt post this, ive waited an hour to see if i change my mind, but i think folk should share my experience.  I will of course update it later as i'll be right on the phone to them when they open Thursday morning.

[Tn21]

If you are local to London you can try and go to Thier physical shop which I believe is near Hatton gardens to try and deal with it face to face.

I only ever bought from them once as it was not the most straightforward online purchase I just ended up sticking to Atkinson's and fellow forum members.

Pls do keep us updated, hope your order gets fulfilled or a full refund. 

 

[jultorsk]

I've had one encounter with Baird and let's just say I'll never purchase anything from them anymore. I hope you get your order sorted out.

[Serendipity]

I successfully registered with Baird but found it much more convoluted than registering with any other bullion dealer with the exception of the Royal Mint Bullion which involves pre-funding a special bullion account. The whole process of ordering online seems just as equally daunting which is why I’ve actually not bought anything from them.

One of the major reasons entrepreneur Rob Halliday-Stein, founder of Bullion By Post, set up his successful bullion business was because he couldn’t find anyone offering clear pricing and decent customer service when he wanted to buy gold and silver. He realised there was a gap in the market, learned all he could, and started the business.

In fairness to Baird, and I’m not in any way defending them if you have a legitimate grievance, bullion dealers require personal identification in line with HMRC requirements if the price for the goods is over £5,000 - two forms of personal ID if the customer is an individual and, if the customer is a business, one form of personal ID from an individual within the business who has authority to sell the goods.

[mr-dead]

ordered a 1kg gold bar from Baird's with no problems.

regarding I.D if you place an order of over £5k in one order or £10k with a dealer in a year you must provide I.D  it's a legal AML requirement.

they are the UK's largest previous metal refiner and well established so I'm sure you'll get things sorted out.

[Martlet]

This is Anti-money Laundering/Know your Customer legislation, and should apply with any business if you buy more than 5000 worth.  The problem this creates in an online world is indeed an interesting one.  When i found this i set a bank account to send me the statement (configurable) so i always have something with name&address. 

Sounds like their procedure has gone a little haywire as you provided ID but it wasn't meeting their higher standard.  Now technically as you did not comply they should not have accepted your order and so you cannot be liable for any fees or cancellation penalties. 

Would suggest highlighting this and polity point out their own FAQs says "up to the value of £10,000 GBP may be executed without any identification" and you'd like to complete the transaction (you paid right? not trying to cancel, avoid change in price).  When there's a problem give them the opportunity to row back, even if you are in the right, so it defuses entrenched position. 

[Cornishfarmer]

I’ve dealt with them a few times,    Website not easy.   Sure they will sort out.   Probably an automatic email.     They are a huge bullion refiner but they should be more on the ball with its retail customers 

[JunkBond]

I bought £5k of gold from Baird over 2 orders to avoid the ID issue and dealt with them via phone. Had zero issues and would definitely use them again.

[firestacker]

Sounds like its time to phone them up and get it sorted that way. Their proof of address requirements do sound rather outdated.

[Norskgeld]

I bought half a sov from them at London Coin Fair a while back and they asked for ID.

[JunkBond]

7 minutes ago, Norskgeld said:

I bought half a sov from them at London Coin Fair a while back and they asked for ID.

Did you ask why?

[Norskgeld]

Yup, chap said it was "for their records".

Thought it was a bit odd but I really wanted the coin.

[AndrewSL76]

I buy from Baird a fair bit. I go into their shop in Hatton Garden - it's just around the corner from Hatton Garden Metals and (luckily for me - my workplace). I have never experienced any problems with them at all. The first few times going there can be a bit intimidating, but after a while it becomes part of the theatre of buying from them! 

I can appreciate that you are clearly having some problems - if you are able to do so - I would suggest you call into see them or get someone you trust to do so with written consent to act as an agent for you.

Andrew.

[5huggy]

The original post by @SendYourCoin2Me outlines a clear FUBAR from Baird as their system is in this day and age is a little pathetic!

The anti laundering rules are (in my opinion, a cover for  - "lets track"!)

I can buy a car for 38K and no questions asked!🙄

A bit of metal - and "THEY" want everything down to your bloodgroup! 😣

IMHO

Hope you get it sorted with them buddy! 👍

 

[Silvergun]

First time using them i bought a half sovereign  everything was ok  selected the coin payed for it no problems , few months later tried to buy a £500 + coin they wanted ID proof , utility bill , etc so gave up not worth the hassle . never used them since .

[SendYourCoin2Me]

I've scoured their site and the regulations for "Know your customer" kick in at 10k.

They have advised this morning that they will complete my order as a 'guest' and will remove my ID from their system.  Its a weird company policy that if you tell them you might shop there again, even if its less than the 10K annual limit, they make you do the ID thing.  Im happy to checkout as a guest because theres no way i will attempt a future purchase.  A brlliant refinery but an absolutey shocking retailer in this day and age.

Next time I get a dated letter from a bank or something, I'll be putting it into the safe for future use, it'll be worth its weight in gold! 😂

I will post a photo of the order when it arrives (Note i said When, not If, im feeling some positive mental attitude might help today)

[SendYourCoin2Me]

3 hours ago, Martlet said:

This is Anti-money Laundering/Know your Customer legislation, and should apply with any business if you buy more than 5000 worth.  The problem this creates in an online world is indeed an interesting one.  When i found this i set a bank account to send me the statement (configurable) so i always have something with name&address. 

Sounds like their procedure has gone a little haywire as you provided ID but it wasn't meeting their higher standard.  Now technically as you did not comply they should not have accepted your order and so you cannot be liable for any fees or cancellation penalties. 

Would suggest highlighting this and polity point out their own FAQs says "up to the value of £10,000 GBP may be executed without any identification" and you'd like to complete the transaction (you paid right? not trying to cancel, avoid change in price).  When there's a problem give them the opportunity to row back, even if you are in the right, so it defuses entrenched position. 

I might just do that with one of my bank accounts so that i get something 'official'

I wonder how i proved my address to the bank when i set it up😂

 

Also, out of interest, i checked my order out at this mornings live prices, and its £300 cheaper than when i placed my order request last week.  Small change for them but perhaps if the price had gone the other way the sales agent would have cancelled the earlier order.

[Abyss]

My experiences with Baird & Co I have gone through the validation process and have setup an account with them. They need cleared funds in their account and your account is successfully validated and opened before you can place an order (3-4 working days). Last year I was in the process buying gold and had transferred money into Baird account. After speaking with the owner of the European Mint they offered me more competitive price and I requested funds transferred out of Baird account back into my account. Some questions raised why I had transferred sizeable amount money into Baird account and then requested funds returned (my excuse at the time because waiting time process application spot price moved away where I wanted to buy). Pleasant conversation with Baird and the funds transferred back the next working day without any delays. I have never purchased any metals from Baird but kept my account opened (already validated) in case in the future I wanted to buy from them.

As Mr-Dead stated they are the UK's largest previous metal refiner and well established.

[Gildeon]

1 hour ago, SendYourCoin2Me said:

I might just do that with one of my bank accounts so that i get something 'official'

I wonder how i proved my address to the bank when i set it up😂

 

I always used utility bills and they are fine for this. Not getting them by mail but I can always download a PDF from my online account, from electricity, broadband etc. You must have something like this I suppose.

[SILVERFINGER]

Jeez I am saving and am close to getting one of their 100oz bars which I really like, but I don't suffer fools gladly and will probably do a lot of research before buying from them now, lets hope you get everything sorted to your satisfaction, keep us updated.

[Cornishfarmer]

2 minutes ago, SILVERFINGER said:

Jeez I am saving and am close to getting one of their 100oz bars which I really like, but I don't suffer fools gladly and will probably do a lot of research before buying from them now, lets hope you get everything sorted to your satisfaction, keep us updated.

they are a good price but do they add vat to it?

[SILVERFINGER]

13 minutes ago, Cornishfarmer said:

they are a good price but do they add vat to it?

Yes I think so, but I am collecting bars as much as stacking so price isn't as big an issue as looks lol

[Cornishfarmer]

11 minutes ago, SILVERFINGER said:

Yes I think so, but I am collecting bars as much as stacking so price isn't as big an issue as looks lol

I’ve got one.   So when you go to buy pm me to see if we can do a deal for it

[SILVERFINGER]

9 minutes ago, Cornishfarmer said:

I’ve got one.   So when you go to buy pm me to see if we can do a deal for it

Must be near mint, in its original packaging with cert 

[Cornishfarmer]

or

18 minutes ago, SILVERFINGER said:

Must be near mint, in its original packaging with cert 

original packaging and cert             not sure about condition, if interested when it comes to it ill take out of storage and send pictures