Fake Jubilee Shield Half Sovereigns (1887)

[ilovesilverireallydo]

So bought 10 sovs from a guy. Looked legit but when I weighed them one was 3.5gms so that triggered alarms. As is my standard practice took them to be tested. 

Two fakes, one is 14ct and the other 11ct. 

Took them to another contact- he thinks the 14ct is a much older forgery, maybe even period forgery.

[JunkBond]

I reckon there are a lot of fakes for 1887, there always seems loads for sale compared to the other jubilee years.

@Roy was collecting fake halves for his museum of shame iirc.

[ilovesilverireallydo]

Just to note: was a trusted seller and he’s refunded me the difference 

[Pipers]

So who was it?

[Pipers]

They seem pretty good fakes, are they centred when you turn them over on the axis. 

[ilovesilverireallydo]

20 minutes ago, Pipers said:

They seem pretty good fakes, are they centred when you turn them over on the axis. 

Yep centred. 

 

26 minutes ago, Pipers said:

So who was it?

On another group. They made it right - were mortified - so wont name and shame

[HawkHybrid]

on the left coin, does the 18(8)7 look a little

more tilted to the left?

 

HH

[JunkBond]

2 hours ago, ilovesilverireallydo said:

Just to note: was a trusted seller

How can you be a trusted seller and pass on a half sov that weighs 3.5g

Two in ten fake is pretty worrying too.

[ilovesilverireallydo]

16 minutes ago, HawkHybrid said:

on the left coin, does the 18(8)7 look a little

more tilted to the left?

 

HH

I think that may be the angle I took photo. Tried to take head on photo here. It’s the 14.9ct one 

[ilovesilverireallydo]

8 minutes ago, JunkBond said:

How can you be a trusted seller and pass on a half sov that weighs 3.5g

Two in ten fake is pretty worrying too.

Trusted in the sense I knew if anything was wrong they would refund straight away - they buy from a contact in bulk and dont test all. I would stand by it as he refunded me within 5 mins of sending him the pics. 

[Roy]

2 hours ago, JunkBond said:

I reckon there are a lot of fakes for 1887, there always seems loads for sale compared to the other jubilee years.

@Roy was collecting fake halves for his museum of shame iirc.

1887 seems to be a common year for fakes and for all denominations of sovereigns.

I think they're fascinating 😀

@ilovesilverireallydo, I'd buy them for their gold weight if you like, though I expect you'd like to keep them?

[JunkBond]

3 minutes ago, ilovesilverireallydo said:

I think that may be the angle I took photo. Tried to take head on photo here. It’s the 14.9ct one 

 

Looks cast, not very sharp legend. 👍

[ilovesilverireallydo]

5 minutes ago, Roy said:

@ilovesilverireallydo, I'd buy them for their gold weight if you like, though I expect you'd like to keep them?

Sorry bud - already had an offer from another member I have made a deal with - otherwise would have been happy for them to go to you. 

[Roy]

 No probs mate, a deal is a deal 👍

 

[JunkBond]

What happened to the tulips @Roy 🤔

[Roy]

I fancied a makeover.

Bought some new glasses too 

[goldmember44]

Unfortunately the forgeries are very realistic, made in China... and have flooded Ebay as of late. And, of course... from Ebay it goes everywhere... even ends up in some trusted collections, if they are not cautious. So make doubly  sure... really, these fakes are all over Ebay and they look convincing...  it's not only sovereigns, but I've noticed very precise-looking silver fakes too of popular silver coins.

[augur]

1 hour ago, ilovesilverireallydo said:

I think that may be the angle I took photo. Tried to take head on photo here. It’s the 14.9ct one 

The lettering is sub standard, IEB quiete pronounced for the wear and Victoria seems to have a frog in her throat.

Always easy to see with magnification but in hand it's another story...

The 11ct has a very suspicious rim on both sides. These are "bad" fakes but others are very hard to distinguish. 

[Coincollector]

We’re these ment to be sovereigns or half sovereigns? Did you measure the diameter and depth?

[ilovesilverireallydo]

3 minutes ago, Coincollector said:

We’re these ment to be sovereigns or half sovereigns? Did you measure the diameter and depth?

Half sovs. They were ever so slightly larger  - thats the first reason that made me suspicious - they didnt fit perfectly in the capsules meant for them - which is why I weighed them. 

Depth I didnt check. 

 

7 minutes ago, augur said:

The lettering is sub standard, IEB quiete pronounced for the wear and Victoria seems to have a frog in her throat.

 Always easy to see with magnification but in hand it's another story...

The 11ct has a very suspicious rim on both sides. These are "bad" fakes but others are very hard to distinguish. 

I think the dirt on the edges make it stand out more. In hand they were nearly indistinguishable by the naked eye - especially when they were with 8 ohers of which 3 were also (genuine) Jubilee ones. 

[mustynewb]

If one turns out to be a period forgery does that increase its value in any way?

[ilovesilverireallydo]

2 minutes ago, mustynewb said:

If one turns out to be a period forgery does that increase its value in any way?

I dunno - I think there are collectors of stuff like this. I have had 9 ct and 14ct half sovs in the past and sold them for same premium as a normal half. (over spot value). 

[JunkBond]

20 minutes ago, Coincollector said:

We’re these ment to be sovereigns or half sovereigns? Did you measure the diameter and depth?

Full sovs would be G&D reverse.

[ilovesilverireallydo]

5 minutes ago, JunkBond said:

Full sovs would be G&D reverse.

correct - in this example of the Jubilee head. They did a Younghead version that year with a shield reverse. I HAVE seen a Jubilee Full sov with a Shield Reverse which baffled me. It was 14ct. Sold it to some guy as a curiosity for 15% more than it cost me lol. 

[ilovesilverireallydo]

@augur interestingly Chards have also documented a fake version of this