Bullion Kangaroos as stack base

[Bullionbilly]

7 hours ago, sovereignsteve said:

 

I don't think I have ever had a silver coin spot while in my care, and I have lots of elephants and lions, the oldest beast.

What methods do you use ?

 

[Abyss]

Bullion Kangaroos as stack base someone based in the United Kingdom IMHO bad choice. I faced the same decision when deciding upon my stack base came across the following YouTube video titled Full Stack 6500 Ounces My Foundation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPZgW6kLSKo

In the end I decided by stack base would be 50x 2 oz and 10x 10 oz Silver Queens Beasts Silver coins for total 2,000 oz silver when series completed. I believed that even if major fall in the silver price hopefully the premiums on the coins would negate this and when series completed if I was to sell the coins as a complete series would attract higher premium than the individual coins themselves.

Due to the premiums on the earlier coins it is not worth backdating but if I was staring out today I would make standard 1 oz Britannia as my foundation stack.

20 minutes ago, Bullionbilly said:

What methods do you use ?

In the tubes I have added Desiccant Sachets and Anti-Tarnish Paper Silver Protector to try ensure coins remain as prestine as possible i first came across this information from ShadowStack video

Queen's Beasts Milk Spot Maintenance + Capsule Dealers    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQULwYk2sTg&t=212s

[Abyss]

Buying couple hundred 100 oz+ Silver as your base I would email European Mint and ask the can offer a better price chances are they will sell you 1 oz Brit 15.20 euros or still wanted Kangaroo 15.25 euros via custom quote price wise not much between them.

 

 

[sovereignsteve]

4 hours ago, Bullionbilly said:

What methods do you use ?

 

Nothing special. About 5 years ago when I started stacking some silver I bought a job lot of  airtites and then bought some cheaper clones from the US. I decided to cap all my bullion figuring that an extra 20 to 25 p per coin was worth it as I don't have that much out and out bullion as it's a sideline to my collecting and most of my stack are capsuled semi-nums anyway.

I do remember buying a tube of elephants from this forum about 3 years ago, the top coin was well toned and milked. I put the rest in airtites and they are fine to this day😊

[silenceissilver]

19 hours ago, sovereignsteve said:

They can spot but contrary to what people say about milking being caused by mint blank washing, I think there's an element of coin storage conditions in there too.

I don't think I have ever had a silver coin spot while in my care, and I have lots of elephants and lions, the oldest beast.

Interesting

19 hours ago, sixgun said:

Personally i would get the QB's - i would expect a rising premium on these - some will spot - and some will not - on balance i think i would make more money on QB's that bog standard Kangaroos. Obviously our choice in the end

I might actually do that, given what Sovereign Steve has shared about his experience with spotting.

 

17 hours ago, AgCoyote said:

If spotting is a big deal, you can eliminate them. Simply get a pencil eraser, erase the mark and then put it in hot soapy water. Boom it'll be gone. I did this with 10 2013 Canada Polar Bears, a Brittania, and my Falcon and the spots are all gone.

Not sure if this is advisable for semi numismatic coins, but good to know about the option. Maybe in 20 years they are rare enough that this treatment doesn't affect the price considerably. Would it now actually? I don't know.

[sovereignsteve]

I also bought a tube each of the RCM Birds of Prey and put these in airtites too, no milk in sight as yet😊

[silenceissilver]

12 hours ago, Abyss said:

Bullion Kangaroos as stack base someone based in the United Kingdom IMHO bad choice.

I'm from the continent andI don't care about these taxes in 20 years, I think the Western societies will be torn apart due to the dramatic demographic changes and additonally if this tax still applies I will sell it on the continent. Also, because I endorse patriotism, I think I will be kicked out of the country sooner or later anyway. We currently have soft totalitarianism but multicultural totalitarianism will get less and less soft, it's only a few years before I will qualify as dissident, I g

 

12 hours ago, Abyss said:

In the tubes I have added Desiccant Sachets and Anti-Tarnish Paper Silver Protector to try ensure coins remain as prestine as possible i first came across this information from ShadowStack video

Queen's Beasts Milk Spot Maintenance + Capsule Dealers    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQULwYk2sTg&t=212s

I have anti tarnish paper in the tubes and in every single air tite capsule, for all bullion coins that are not in tubes. And a recharable desiccant. If this helps over years, then that would be a big factor to go for the Beasts

[silenceissilver]

2 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

I also bought a tube each of the RCM Birds of Prey and put these in airtites too, no milk in sight as yet😊

I got a tube of Maple Leafs today, no spotting spotted yet either 😁

Anti tarnish paper added

[silenceissilver]

On 06/03/2019 at 23:47, sixgun said:

Beasts are spotters as well. i would say the absolute worst the Royal Canadian Mint - then it is just luck or bad luck with Brits, Beasts, Phillies, Elephants, ASE's....Really you have to get Perth Mint lunars and the like to be sure. Then you are paying a premium. i have not seen a spotted Lunar I so they seem to stand the test of time. In 20 years a collector coin in good nick is going to repay the premium you paid. i have tended to get bars more recently b/c i don't have to worry about spotting and if they tarnish this adds to the character. i appreciate your point about 1oz coins makes the stack more flexible. Personally i would go for a broad spectrum of silver - that way you spread risks. Buying a couple of monster boxes of Kangaroos and then in a few years finding that most of them are milked up would be a real downer. i had a few tubes of Elephants the other year. Half of them got milk spot after about 18 months - i was gutted - they might all be spotted now.

Have you ever heard of the Perth Mint Dragon 1oz rectangular coins spotting? From a tax point of view they are still coins, they are 1oz pieces and they are 4 9 silver. And the price is still not that much over that of Kangaroos. If they wouldn't spot for sure, I might buy them. The only thing I don't like about them, the design, to me, is an expression of the Western civilisation having lost her soul and having stopped believing in anything. As nice as the design is optically, what does an apparently Chinese dragon on a Western coin express, if not Western nihilism? They are a bit soulless, if you wish. And very square for a coin. But otherwise they seem to be what I'm looking for - if they don't spot, indeed.

[sixgun]

@silenceissilver - i actually considered mentioning this bar to you - it is on the better value side of things so good to bulk up a silver stack. i am not aware of spotting

I see mention of spots on this listing - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2018-1oz-Rectangular-Dragon-Silver-Coin-in-coin-capsule-9999-fine-silver-/173688805022

Please note that these coins can have or develop "milk spots", natural discolouration or tarnish due to the purity of the silver. I do not accept returns due to the appearance of the product as it is a natural process and beyond my control. I take full responsibility for the silver content only.  

The way this reads sounds like a disclaimer for any milk spot there might be rather saying they definitely have milk spot.

The bar falls between an art bar and bullion. i don't see it appreciating much as there must be lots of them out there but it is quite an appealing looking things. They are legal tender so whilst the window remains open to import these from the EU they represent good value. The design is appealing to me on the dragon side - Queen Lizard is looking a little grumpy though.

 

[silenceissilver]

16 minutes ago, sixgun said:

@silenceissilver - i actually considered mentioning this bar to you - it is on the better value side of things so good to bulk up a silver stack. i am not aware of spotting

I see mention of spots on this listing - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2018-1oz-Rectangular-Dragon-Silver-Coin-in-coin-capsule-9999-fine-silver-/173688805022

Please note that these coins can have or develop "milk spots", natural discolouration or tarnish due to the purity of the silver. I do not accept returns due to the appearance of the product as it is a natural process and beyond my control. I take full responsibility for the silver content only.  

The way this reads sounds like a disclaimer for any milk spot there might be rather saying they definitely have milk spot.

The bar falls between an art bar and bullion. i don't see it appreciating much as there must be lots of them out there but it is quite an appealing looking things. They are legal tender so whilst the window remains open to import these from the EU they represent good value. The design is appealing to me on the dragon side - Queen Lizard is looking a little grumpy though.

 

Having the Queen on the reverse is certainly not desirable in any shape, age or form but that's the case with all this 4 9 silver. I think you are right it looks like a general disclaimer. I think I will go for this one unless I become aware of spotting the next days before I will order my base stack. Thanks again!

Edit: The Queen is on the obverse, I guess

[KevinFlynn]

On 06/03/2019 at 23:00, silenceissilver said:

...

Ad 3) [...] You need to get rid of it before you throw them into the melting pot, if you want actual 999.9

...

I would not worry about that specific, as I doubt any chemical clinging to the coins will survive a 1000° melt.

I agree with the basic idea about maximum purity.

[silenceissilver]

4 minutes ago, KevinFlynn said:

I would not worry about that specific, as I doubt any chemical clinging to the coins will survive a 1000° melt.

I agree with the basic idea about maximum purity.

If that is the case I could even buy Maples. Brings me back to Kangaroos though, I think I will go for them, they are still cheaper than the rectangular Dragons. Thanks for the input!

[FoolzGold]

Plenty of good sense replies above. Personally I dabbled in various silver bullion coins before coming to the conclusion that currently the 2oz and 10oz QB bullion coins seem to be the best bet at present.

At worst they are bullion coins at a very small premium over the bog-standard bullion coins like the kangaroo and maple leaf. And they (imho) look much nicer.

At best they appear to be gaining a very healthy semi-numismatic premium as they go out of production, something that will never be the case with the standard bullion coins.

There are a couple of other designs I buy because I like the look but otherwise it's QBs all the way for me.

[SouthCoastInvestor]

I have a couple of Kangaroos and one had milk spots from the dealer - I think it was a 2017 like the one in your picture.

So they definitely do spot.  But it is not something that I worry about.

 

[silenceissilver]

On 06/03/2019 at 22:18, sovereignsteve said:

Well I'm not so sure this is the right choice. Just going by GS.BE prices:

kangaroo €15.33/oz

What about the 2oz bullion Beast Yale at €32 ie €16/oz

Hardly a difference but you'll always be able to sell the beasts at a higher premium than the roos.

Unless you're going to wait until silver soars and dump your stack to a metal dealer in which case you'll probably get the same price for all the coins.

You say you want flexibility so my point is you could sell a tube of beasts here and there for a nice premium.

Depends on your end game really.

Took your suggestion into account to go for QBs and also @sixgun s about diversification, at least somewhat and bought unicorn beats and kangaroos in a weight ratio of 12 to 5, after all. Ordered from the European Mint, so soon I'll be a member of the monster box club.