2018 Piedfort Sovereign Design

[d13avo]

Is it a definite now that the royal mint will issue a piedfort sovereign every year?

[SovTracker]

As an update, as of yesterday afternoon The Mint had sold just over 300 Piedfort and 500 Prince George.

Neither appear to be smash hits and the Piedfort looks like it could be a disaster - not unexpected IMHO. 

The Mint are just producing too much and need to stop these silly - "we've sold out on this in one day" marketing ploys when the 2018 Piedfort is entirely different to the "first ever 2017 Piedfort Sovereign".

Am I right in thinking that looking at this coin it looks exactly the same as the 2018 Proof Sovereign - it's just twice the thickness?

If so why buy it - other than there's twice the Gold - at an inflated price based on Spot.

[*tada*]

34 minutes ago, SovTracker said:

As an update, as of yesterday afternoon The Mint had sold just over 300 Piedfort and 500 Prince George.

Neither appear to be smash hits and the Piedfort looks like it could be a disaster - not unexpected IMHO. 

The Mint are just producing too much and need to stop these silly - "we've sold out on this in one day" marketing ploys when the 2018 Piedfort is entirely different to the "first ever 2017 Piedfort Sovereign".

Am I right in thinking that looking at this coin it looks exactly the same as the 2018 Proof Sovereign - it's just twice the thickness?

If so why buy it - other than there's twice the Gold - at an inflated price based on Spot.

damn they should have stick to a low mintage on the piedfort, but then they'll run out of ideas for next year...

Again, 2k+ mintage on Piedfort is way too high. Sub 1k is the way to go. RM may trick people to think one year of lower mintage means new "key" date but hey there are only 2 years so far!

Hope the RM learns the lesson from all other mints in the world. Make 2017 and 2018 the only 2 Piedfort issues, and maybe do another in 2020 if possible, then call it a day. Otherwise they lose investor confidence fast. There is almost no chance for a successful annual issue.

The only popular gold piedfort annual (sort of) issue I see currently is from Royal Dutch Mint, ie the lion dollar. And they change design every year, will be a mini series, and super low mintage. This is piedfort done right.

[kimchi]

1 hour ago, SovTracker said:

As an update, as of yesterday afternoon The Mint had sold just over 300 Piedfort and 500 Prince George.

What's the source for those figures please? I'm very surprised if that's the case (are these not direct sales from the Mint to the public?) - that would then be to the dealers only. It can't be both as a total from what I've heard.

The George SotD has never attracted much interest or even mention in previous years, I'm surprised this year has done so well (plus it's been out for two months compared to the Piedfort's 5 days). This is the first year I've seen it even mentioned on here alongside the 'proper' Sov issues (i.e. Crown or anniversary Sov related, rather than personal royal family related).

1 hour ago, SovTracker said:

The Mint are just producing too much and need to stop these silly - "we've sold out on this in one day" marketing ploys when the 2018 Piedfort is entirely different to the "first ever 2017 Piedfort Sovereign".

Am I right in thinking that looking at this coin it looks exactly the same as the 2018 Proof Sovereign - it's just twice the thickness?

If so why buy it - other than there's twice the Gold - at an inflated price based on Spot.

That was a marketing mistake for sure but I don't think it's been detrimental to sales. Yes, it's the same as the Proof 2018 - with the privy, just double the weight/thickness. I bought mine because I'm a modern Sovereign collector and if I didn't have it I'd be missing 1/3 of the Sapphire Coronation special issues. Having all at PF70 will be a lovely collection and one I'll enjoy for very many years to come

21 hours ago, d13avo said:

Is it a definite now that the royal mint will issue a piedfort sovereign every year?

I would say no - not unless there's a reason to. Alas the Mint don't seem to have much common sense so they might try, but I'd argue there have been a number of 'special' Sovs this last year and a half that have far worse prospects than this one at a similar premium. If they make it annual (even when there is nothing special on it) or just keep it for special occassions, both are good for this coin imvho.

43 minutes ago, *tada* said:

Again, 2k+ mintage on Piedfort is way too high. Sub 1k is the way to go. RM may trick people to think one year of lower mintage means new "key" date but hey there are only 2 years so far!

Hope the RM learns the lesson from all other mints in the world. Make 2017 and 2018 the only 2 Piedfort issues, and maybe do another in 2020 if possible, then call it a day. Otherwise they lose investor confidence fast. There is almost no chance for a successful annual issue.

I think the mintage could be reasonable seeing as we don't know how this will go in the future, I certainly wouldn't write this off when 2018 Proof Sovs are already shaping up very nicely on the secondary market at over4 x the mintage. For me this slow sell-out doesn't put me off at all. In fact it means that should mine arrive in less than top condition I will have a return for a replacement instead of the usual 'here's your money back, and sorry for the disappointment, rest assured we will have you first on the list when the Queen Camilla commemorative goes on sale'.

If they fail to sell out and end up melting some of the coins so much the better too! I am calm on this one - it doesn't look like making fortunes ever but I won't be selling anyway - my family will be inheriting this one, and long-term I think it could do OK for them

 

[westminstrel]

To be honest, the 2018 Sovereign can still be got for about issue price at several places. And the 2017 Piedfort might be seen to be selling on eBay for less than issue price. Who’dathunkit! ?

[sovereignsteve]

28 minutes ago, westminstrel said:

To be honest, the 2018 Sovereign can still be got for about issue price at several places. And the 2017 Piedfort might be seen to be selling on eBay for less than issue price. Who’dathunkit! ?

[Oldun]

Come on, I know there must be an ocd out there who has made or wants to make a spreadsheet of how sovs have performed compared to issue price

[MancunianStacker]

2 hours ago, Oldun said:

Come on, I know there must be an ocd out there who has made or wants to make a spreadsheet of how sovs have performed compared to issue price

That would be nice but you can easily see the sold prices on eBay. 

[kimchi]

On 04/08/2018 at 08:47, MancunianStacker said:

That would be nice but you can easily see the sold prices on eBay. 

Just checked out both, recommend everyone does so for themselves, both look pretty good to me

[Roy]

4 hours ago, MancunianStacker said:

That would be nice but you can easily see the sold prices on eBay. 

I'm not so good with ebay..

If I search sold listings and nothing comes up, does it mean just that? None have sold?

[MancunianStacker]

@Roy I’m not sure how far back it goes? It might just be 6 moths - 1 year??

[Roy]

Thanks.

I was looking for 2018 Proof Sovereign PF69.

I found a 70.

Is there a rule of thumb like £50 less for each grade? 

[kimchi]

On 04/08/2018 at 13:32, Roy said:

I'm not so good with ebay..

If I search sold listings and nothing comes up, does it mean just that? None have sold?

I just searched for 'piedfort sovereign' and 'proof sovereign 2018' and then ticked the 'sold' box. 'Completed' shows you the ones that didn't sell (with final sale value in black) as well as the ones that did (in green).

As far back as I could be bothered to look they were all raw coins that came up and both generally doing well. Yes some folk got bargains under Mint price on the 2018 proof but other folk were happy to pay a decent amount more. I'd say the sellers of the ones who did badly didn't maximise their potential sale, or perhaps there was a suspicion that some of them weren't great examples. I'm covered there in that my proofs are 70s and I expect the same pretty much for the SotD and the Piedfort.

As pointed out, the 2018 proof is still available from a few places, and yet on here around a month after release a 70 sold for £500. A couple of weeks later someone was happy to pay £550 (delivered I think). Not too shabby when you can still get new coins from some sellers.

People may not like these coins or what the Mint is doing, particularly purists and/or long-term collectors, that's completely understandable. However I think these will do OK, particularly the 2018 Proof at 70.

If you want to flip and make some money we all know what the hot one is in gold graded well (for now) - the QB.

[kimchi]

Hearing rumours the Mint's quality control has not been too good on these. Anyone else heard the same?

I'd check these very carefully when they arrive.

Interesting the Mint website went into 'awaiting stock' a few days ago. I wouldn't be ordering one from the Mint when/if they come back into stock as there's a good chance you'd be into Returns territory.

[Goldmick]

I got mine from the coin connection on here. Will have it tomorrow she said about 40% was not up to there standard. Does sound bad its good the coin connection checks all theres before sending. So big thanks to them. Will post pic.s when i get mine 

[Harry]

Supply and demand baby. They keep making, we keep buying. It's a big out lay for 1 coin, wouldn't you rather 2 sovereigns? Sovereigns will now be sold as "Half Piedforts" haha. I went through coin connection. They're brilliant but there stock comes from abroad I believe and not the RM. As long as Adele and her team send me a PF70, I'm not fussed.

[Goldmick]

Im only gunna have the 2 of them the 2017 (first one) and the 2018 privy think that will do me. I got a 70 on the 2017. Not sure if i can be bothered to grade the 2018 one. I hate the waiting for ngc lol. I do like them them in the slab but hate the hassle. 

[Guest]

My 2018 Piefort should arrive from Adele tomorrow and I will be doing a video review on the coin and the Coin Connection as well.

Its great to have someone that cares enough to QA these coins when the RM just dont care enough to do it themselves.

I will be taking mine over to the USA and dropping it off for First Releases slabbing at the NGC stand at the ANA in Philadelphia

[Goldmick]

Here it is its well lovely big thanks to the coin connection im well happy and look at my coa no. 

[kimchi]

Received mine as promised, luckily I got my order in early, many thanks to @TheCoinConnection!

The only thing is, they are so lovingly packaged it seems a shame to open! It almost feels like you should really have a glass of fine wine and Belgian chocolate to hand, must remember for next time! They have three more available atm on the website - I'd 100% recommend them for anyone wanting one of these.

Very nice, very pleased with my first Piedfort

I also got a low CoA - always a very welcome bonus! @Goldmick what is the date on the label on the back of the box? Mine says 16/07/2018 - perhaps that's the minting date?

 

 

[kimchi]

I love how in the booklet it takes a whole page to explain how difficult it was for two of their expert designers to design the '65' Sapphire 'mintmark' and then work out where to put it...and then the accompanying picture shows it on the wrong side of the coin

[Goldmick]

4 hours ago, kimchi said:

Received mine as promised, luckily I got my order in early, many thanks to @TheCoinConnection!

The only thing is, they are so lovingly packaged it seems a shame to open! It almost feels like you should really have a glass of fine wine and Belgian chocolate to hand, must remember for next time! They have three more available atm on the website - I'd 100% recommend them for anyone wanting one of these.

Very nice, very pleased with my first Piedfort

I also got a low CoA - always a very welcome bonus! @Goldmick what is the date on the label on the back of the box? Mine says 16/07/2018 - perhaps that's the minting date?

 

 

Yes same date. there lovely coins glad i got one what coa no did you get is it near mine. Pm if you dont want to say on here lol

[Goldmick]

3 more likes for my big 1000 who will get it lol ?

[kimchi]

12 minutes ago, Goldmick said:

Yes same date. there lovely coins glad i got one what coa no did you get is it near mine. Pm if you dont want to say on here lol

Many thanks! I think that was the minting date then probably, I've noticed changes with the Mint in the last few weeks compared to June (Sapphire SotD) - the Paddingtons have the CoA number on the back and now these Piedforts seem to have what looks like the minting day

[SovTracker]

If the date your referring to is on the outer box with a Bar Code, I queried it a few weeks ago with The Mint as one of my two Sapphire Jubilee SotD was dated 1 day after the SotD. They told me it was the packaging date and not the packaging date.

Sometimes they have the coins and not the packaging and not the coins so shows out of stock - also vice versa except for SotD which they tell me MUST be Minted on the actual day.

Also the Certificate numbers are a joke - you can get the first coin of the "press" and get a high number or number 1000 could be Cert No 1 - quality control heh.