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13 minutes ago, Thelonerangershorse said:

Big drops in the last couple of hours, Ideas anyone?

 

They knew we would be going for group order buys this weekend, so the guys at JP Morgan are helping us out maybe?

Visit my website for all my Hand Poured Silver: http://backyardbullion.com

And check out my YouTube channel 

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Bleyer Bullion is the South West's local bullion dealer, serving the whole of the UK by phone and online. Bleyer offers friendly, expert consultancy and welcomes face-to-face appointments with UK customers looking for a more personal service. Please visit us at: www.BleyerBullion.co.uk.

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my best guess on the current move is that pm's were set to

drift lower over the summer months. something spooked it

causing the price rise yesterday. having calmed down the

price has dropped to what it would have been and maybe

continue the drift for the rest of the summer.

if you ignore all the excessive hype about how undervalued it

is and accept that a healthy long term movement is a

gradual rise with cyclical moves each year then it's done

nothing out of the ordinary.

 

HH

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Has been trending up recently so the fixers decided it needed a kick back down. Frequently happens on a friday, not sure if there's a trading opportunity here, maybe someone could do some back-testing?

Profile picture with thanks to Carl Vernon

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2 minutes ago, BackyardBullion said:

They knew we would be going for group order buys this weekend, so the guys at JP Morgan are helping us out maybe?

I did want a couple more coins, but didn't get chance last weekend, then I've been sat all week watching the price rise steadily form £12.50 up to £12.98 then last hour of Friday and, Wham, back to £12.50:D

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sovereignsteve has it. Most of us know the score.

In the TF Metals interview Andrew Maguire and Tom Coghlan gave which i posted on the Kinesis thread i created, Maguire put the hex on price.  He said silver was looking to breakout. Silver was looking to breakout and then the usual culprits turned it into a fake out. i saw price pretty quiet and then starting to rounding over as we went into the Euro lunchtime - a quiet period and then price got dumped in the run up to the NY opening where the US centric COMEX zombies and algos rule.

Silver got above $17 and held this week. It almost made $17.30 today. Currently price is around $16.52. So more or less we saw an 80 cent fall.

That's 80/1730 the best part of a 5% fall for no good reason. Did Apple suddenly announce their silver requirements would be 30% lower, or did Mexico suddenly release 50 million ounces onto the market? Was there an announcement which merited that move? Did i miss something? The market is quiet and then dump. These aren't normal trading market moves. The controlled media will come up with some reason, profit taking, the Fed rate hike, reduced tensions in Korea - i haven't bothered to look it is meaningless whatever they regurgitate up. We have become so accustomed to these shenanigans it is easy to fail to see.

If silver had not been smacked down the price would have been knocking on $18 and then it could be $21 and then ignition sequence.

All part of fiat currency management against real money. Dump contracts, trigger stops, start a stampede in the hot money and then square off a the end of the day so you don't breach position size rules. Same old same old. Bring on Kinesis to vacuum up the physical and break this paper pantomime.

Always cast your vote - Spoil your ballot slip. Put 'Spoilt Ballot - I do not consent.' These votes are counted. If you do not do this you are consenting to the tyranny. None of them are fit for purpose. 
A tyranny relies on propaganda and force. Once the propaganda fails all that's left is force.

COVID-19 is a cover story for the collapsing economy. Green Energy isn't Green and it isn't Renewable.

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the gold chart($) shows gold drifting lower since feb 2018.

the recent up move is counter trend. the default to stay in

the current trend until something changes the trend is

perfectly normal. the drifting lower itself is counter trend to

the yearly rising up trend.

(I'm currently having trouble uploading charts to illustrate this)

 

HH

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Here we are:
 

Quote

https://seekingalpha.com/news/3364429-gold-futures-tumble-2018-low-trade-worries-higher-dollar?

Gold prices fell to their lowest level of the year and copper prices tumbled as investors reacted to tariffs between the U.S. China as well as a selloff in oil, as Comex gold for August delivery settled -2.3% to $1,278.50/oz.

Gold also was hurt this week by expectations of a more hawkish Federal Reserve after raising its policy rate by a quarter percentage point and signaling two more rate hikes this year.

 

Just cobblers - i can accept copper prices falling, i can accept oil prices falling but not gold. If there were a trade war i would expect gold to rise.

Here in March 2018

PRECIOUS-Gold shines as trade war fears rattle markets.

https://www.reuters.com/article/global-precious/precious-gold-shines-as-trade-war-fears-rattle-markets-idUSL3N1R51T9

So in March a trade war is bullish for gold (correct) and in June it caused a sell off - (err i don't think so)

'A more hawkish Federal Reserve' - this is all La La Land - the economy is shot - there is a panic when the 10 year Treasury goes over 3%, the Fed says all is well, there is full employment but labour participate tells another story and it is mucking about with 1/4% increases for fear of collapsing this super strong economy.

Silver, which the thread is about, has been consolidating since the July 2017 when it put in a low at around $15.13. i think the low in July 2017 was the middle of the night flash crash in silver. Price has been consolidating for since the beginning of 2017. We have had higher lowers and lower highs for sure since July 2017. We were up at the top of the consolidation wedge - if we had got through and stayed above, its off to the races. This is the beginning and end of the price smack down today. They have to paint the charts and keep price inside the wedge. Price has banged up at the top of the wedge several times over the last year and then the usual suspects dump paper on the market and the controlled media invents a reason rather than saying the obvious - the market is rigged. They are attempting to maintain the illusion the USD and all the other fiat currencies aren't progressing to zero where they belong. It is going to get harder and harder to keep price from escaping through the top of the wedge.

Always cast your vote - Spoil your ballot slip. Put 'Spoilt Ballot - I do not consent.' These votes are counted. If you do not do this you are consenting to the tyranny. None of them are fit for purpose. 
A tyranny relies on propaganda and force. Once the propaganda fails all that's left is force.

COVID-19 is a cover story for the collapsing economy. Green Energy isn't Green and it isn't Renewable.

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23 minutes ago, sixgun said:

So in March a trade war is bullish for gold (correct)

 

wrong, look what at happened to the gold price($) since march?

did it not drift lower in the few months that followed?

logic can be wrong. facts are never wrong. don't base your

argument on what 'should' happen. instead look at what 'has'

happened in the past. remember all the logic that went into

fed raising rates will make the gold price go down?

I'm currently of the opinion that once this summer sale in gold

is over it has a better chance of moving up to continue it's

yearly rising trend. this could present itself as a good chance

to buy gold. gold usually leads silver. a wedge pattern is not a

consolidation pattern. it's a gathering strength pattern and

could burst upwards or downwards.

 

HH

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1 minute ago, HawkHybrid said:

wrong, look what at happened to the gold price($) since march?

did it not drift lower in the few months that followed?

logic can be wrong. facts are never wrong. don't base your argument on what 'should' happen. instead look at what 'has' happened in the past. remember all the logic that went into

fed raising rates will make the gold price go down?

I'm currently of the opinion that once this summer sale in gold is over it has a better chance of moving up to continue it's yearly rising trend. this could present itself as a good chance

to buy gold. gold usually leads silver. a wedge pattern is not a consolidation pattern. it's a gathering strength pattern and could burst upwards or downwards.

HH

Not wrong.

You making a line of argument which amounts to a strawman.

My points are:

1 The precious metal market is rigged. Precipitous selloffs are due to the intervention of the BIS, minion central banks and their agents. These falling off a cliff moves result from massive (illegal) position sizing which can happen b/c it is the masters who are behind them and so regulators have to give them a pass.

2 Rather than be honest about the rigging going on, the controlled media make up superficially convincing stories to explain these moves. The stories however on close analysis are nonsense.

Example in March 2018 a trade war was the reason gold price went up. In June 2018 a trade war was the reason gold prices went down.

Which one is it?

A trade war or the serious threat of a trade war should be good for the gold price, so the March 2018 view was correct reasoning to give for the gold price moving up. However we then move to point 2 - the reasons the controlled media give are superficially convincing but are just something to fill the pages with, to fill airtime with when puppet experts come on to talk trash. So on one occasion they by chance come out with a story (not the reason) for the move which does make sense and a few weeks later they come out with the same story which makes no sense. The stories are just a cover to give an illusion that what is happening is free market forces when in reality it isn't.

The reason for the big moves where price falls off a cliff is the BIS and minion central banks and agents are hosing in paper contracts. It is not trade wars, Fed announcement, Farm payroll figures - they are excuses and diversions. This is why logic does not apply other than King Dollar must be defended.

i have heard Andrew Maguire say on many occasions that silver leads gold.

i gave the pattern the wrong name. The rest is correct. The pattern is a triangle which is a consolidation pattern. The silver price is consolidating into a tighter and tighter range - it is coiling. Efforts are being made to stop it breaking up through the down sloping upper resistance line. This is what happened today.

 

 

Always cast your vote - Spoil your ballot slip. Put 'Spoilt Ballot - I do not consent.' These votes are counted. If you do not do this you are consenting to the tyranny. None of them are fit for purpose. 
A tyranny relies on propaganda and force. Once the propaganda fails all that's left is force.

COVID-19 is a cover story for the collapsing economy. Green Energy isn't Green and it isn't Renewable.

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Manipulation conspiracies aside the most convincing answer I've seen is quadruple witching:

refers to the third Friday of every March, June, September and December. On these days, market index futures, market index options, stock options and stock futures expire, usually resulting in increased volatility.

http://www.investinganswers.com/financial-dictionary/stock-market/quadruple-witching-97

Having said that, looking at the charts we haven't seen anything quite so precipitous on those days in the past year at least. But if you were a manipulator surely such large, sudden price moves would only draw attention to you?

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51 minutes ago, DrKarlMoneys said:

Manipulation conspiracies aside the most convincing answer I've seen is quadruple witching:

refers to the third Friday of every March, June, September and December. On these days, market index futures, market index options, stock options and stock futures expire...

Wouldn't that favour market manipulation though, as theses want to be renewed as cheap as possible?

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13 hours ago, sixgun said:

Example in March 2018 a trade war was the reason gold price went up.

 

gold went from ~$1325 in march 2018  to ~$1300 in may 2018.

(if someone can post a chart for this time period it would help

illustrate the point I'm trying to make)

 

13 hours ago, sixgun said:

i have heard Andrew Maguire say on many occasions that silver leads gold.

gold leads silver at the beginning of a bull market.

silver leads gold towards the end of a bull market.

silver tends to lead gold during a bear market.

where could we be now? (which one is relevant?)

gold rose in 2017 continuing it's possible bull run starting

dec 2015. silver was mostly flat 2017. if the bull run

materialises then who's leading who?

 

opinions or theories need to be backed by historical facts.

otherwise it's just gossip.

 

HH

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i have stated the precious metal markets are rigged - you have not discussed that.

i have said the controlled media concoct spurious reasons to explain dramatic moves in price - you have not discussed that.

You seem to be arguing for or against things i haven't mentioned.

i have personally heard Andrew Maguire on many occasions say silver is the first into a rally. When price has been taken down in a wash and rinse cycle, the first sign of the move up will be in silver. You are taking on timescales of weeks, months and years. i am talking about timescales of a few days or even less than that.
 

Always cast your vote - Spoil your ballot slip. Put 'Spoilt Ballot - I do not consent.' These votes are counted. If you do not do this you are consenting to the tyranny. None of them are fit for purpose. 
A tyranny relies on propaganda and force. Once the propaganda fails all that's left is force.

COVID-19 is a cover story for the collapsing economy. Green Energy isn't Green and it isn't Renewable.

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3 minutes ago, sixgun said:

You are taking on timescales of weeks, months and years. i am talking about timescales of a few days or even less than that.

 

most buying physical pm's will be holding onto them for

longer than days before they sell them on, especially bullion.

 

I have no proof or facts that back up my opinion on whether

the markets are rigged or not. what I am saying is that your

proof of the markets being rigged is flawed. so far, either

the data is inconclusive or that the trade wars have little or

no impact on moving the gold price up. it's all based on what

logically 'should' happen.

the media is there to sell stuff. their opinion is irrelevant to

stating facts.

 

HH

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Well i am talking about trading metals - futures - when is the market going to turn to go back in long - silver will give you the first indication. You might be in and out in minutes sometimes.

There is evidence all over the place to tell you the markets are rigged. On Friday the market is quiet. There is nothing happening. We go into the Euro lunch hour - a quiet period. Price starts to roll over slightly. Quiet periods are the main time to take the market down. We are approaching the New York open. Bang - i saw today $35 billion was dumped. We see price taken down. It is in the chart. Massive concentrated sales - over position limits - triggers stops - the trading houses know where these are b/c they are making the markets.

Time and again i have seen price taken down at 2 and 3am GMT. These have been by Eastern European entities which are in reality part of the cartel. Dropping 1000's of contracts in a minute when one or two contracts were going through before hand. Sold at market - sold at any price. This is not economic sense. You sell when you can get a good price not in the middle of the night at any price.

Deutsche Bank admitted it was manipulating the markets and it pointed out others. Maguire took his case of silver price rigging to the SEC - he showed them the evidence, he told them ahead of time when the market would be taken down and it was. The boys from JPM will joke about it. The SEC had to accept Maguire's evidence especially when it played out in real time. Their response about taking real action - 'But think of the economic consequences'. The data is entirely conclusive. When one or two entities sell $billions of contracts in a minute when price is getting too high, crashing the market and the regulator turns a blind eye. i know Maguire has reported this sort of thing 100's of times and nothing ever happens.

The media is there to impress the impressionable. To spin stories, to spin propaganda, to create a mood, to talk bull sh1t.

 

Always cast your vote - Spoil your ballot slip. Put 'Spoilt Ballot - I do not consent.' These votes are counted. If you do not do this you are consenting to the tyranny. None of them are fit for purpose. 
A tyranny relies on propaganda and force. Once the propaganda fails all that's left is force.

COVID-19 is a cover story for the collapsing economy. Green Energy isn't Green and it isn't Renewable.

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Nothing went on last week. The silver price fall was just normal market movements.

No proof of anything dodgy. Not sure what i was talking about when i said massive position sizes taken.

Oh wait a minute....... For those keeping score, it was the single largest one week of short selling in history

https://kingworldnews.com/alert-criminal-bullion-banks-shorted-the-hell-out-of-silver-ahead-of-yesterdays-takedown/

Always cast your vote - Spoil your ballot slip. Put 'Spoilt Ballot - I do not consent.' These votes are counted. If you do not do this you are consenting to the tyranny. None of them are fit for purpose. 
A tyranny relies on propaganda and force. Once the propaganda fails all that's left is force.

COVID-19 is a cover story for the collapsing economy. Green Energy isn't Green and it isn't Renewable.

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new records are being made all the time.

record largest one week of going long in silver.

record humans alive on the planet.

record amount of above ground gold.

I don't get what it's supposed to prove?

 

possible explanation

silver have been going up since 4th june for over a week.

(notice how it's all ok that silver rises 5% over a week and

a half and non of this silver manipulation theory comes

out?) traders take a chance to short it. it rises further.

traders check their other indicators and make a choice to

increase their shorts, especially targeting friday. (for many

traders friday is the day to balance their books). no market

price goes up in a straight line throughout a trend. the

gamble pays off. does winning a trade make you a cheat?

 

HH

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Very interesting to compare the US $ Chart

No drop off. This drop is simply because of the £ getting stronger vs $ based on the interest rate announcement today. 

 

US Gold Chart.jpg

Visit my website for all my Hand Poured Silver: http://backyardbullion.com

And check out my YouTube channel 

https://www.youtube.com/backyardbullion

 

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After reading the MPC report and the cautious approach of the BoE I expect a further small drop in the price of Gold, if however you have the balls for it buying Gold just now may in fact be a wise thing. As can be seen from the silver index I do not see the big rise in price any time soon. An interesting thought though was the slight rise in the platinum price. Now here’s a thought why all the interest in silver and not platinum. I hear very little on the forum if anything about stacking plat. Let alone its numismatic value. Perhaps a subject that BYB or Numistacker might like to cover. Middle of the road could be a good thing, not as dear as Gold and not as cheap as silver. 

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