Average £/oz

[StackemHigh]

It would be good to standardise how the £/oz ratio is worked out.

 

Some folk will include vat, delivery, caps and some won't

 

Some folks take an average for each coin and some on a batch price.

 

And some will add the price of cleaning fluids to the equation and some won't.

[silversword]

I reckon keep it simple: cost to acquire the coin from vendor to you, so postage, taxes, coin price. Everything else is optional extras.

[Pete]

Not complicated !

Everyone knows when they purchase a coin, bar or set of coins what they have paid and that includes shipping and taxes.

Let us call this the net landed cost or NLC.

You also know the weight of fine silver in ounces so cost per ounce = NLC / weight.

If you then average this over all your purchases then you can share this number to the benefit of the rest of us.

If however you have included in your order a box of caps, gloves and spare car parts then don't include them in your NLC.

I order to have meaningful statistics you have to use some logic.

You cannot have a situation where a serious stacker with 5,000 ounces averaged over 3 years reports a figure of £24 per ounce.

Then a newbie gets his first coin on eBay at a bargain of £10 and publishes his average at £10.

We then see two figures of £24 and £10 with no background, so we calculate another average of £34/2 = £17 and we compare to our own numbers.

Totally meaningless exercise and not helping anyone.

We can either take £/oz seriously or just for fun.

If the latter - what's the point ?

Possibly the reason we want this number is to compare with others to see if we are doing well or poorly compared to fellow stackers.

We also like to see trends i.e. Is the average rising or falling ?

With Mickey Mouse numbers you cannot analyse anything.

Thought I would throw my viewpoints into the pot knowing some contributors take this forum seriously.

[motorbikez]

I put mine up just for fun Pete,my average for this year was close on £70 per oz until I bought a few Kook proof sets kilo and 10ozers which pulled it down to £48 or so.

To be perfectly honest I don't care what my average is, because I enjoy the proof coins I buy and unfortunately the coins I buy cost bigtime and spot price has no relevance to them whatsoever.

[Carpe Diem]

We can either take £/oz seriously or just for fun.

If the latter - what's the point ?

With Mickey Mouse numbers you cannot analyse anything.

Thought I would throw my viewpoints into the pot knowing some contributors take this forum seriously.

 

Pete, interesting suggestion, and I believe it could be useful (and interesting!) to see a standardised overview of what people have.

 

The only pitfall I see is that there are too many variables to consider.  You quite rightly distinguish between new / old stackers and other factors, but what about those impulse purchases of some old bit of silver just because we like it or the eBay price seems favourable?  

 

Again, I'm not trying to piss on your parade because it's definitely a valid suggestion but I think that having a more simple reference would a) encourage more to get involved on here b )  at least give a ballpark figure of what people have, and open the door to further discussion of how others managed to reduce their average. 

 

A question that comes from a point you made in the previous post though, even if we had a watertight and fully standardised reference then what point would that serve? Due to changing book values (as a result of changing spot and premiums and demand), different strategies (stackers Vs collectors Vs Stacker-Collectors), the personal evolution of a stacker/collector as they hone their strategy (if they even have one!) are all points that I believe would, in the end, render the agreed standardisation inaccurate.

 

So, as they say, if you don't want something then say what you do want, I think that the method you suggested originally with average ounce limiting it to a few factors such as new collector would be more desirable.

 

I should also mention however that I personally wouldn't get involved with that as I'd prefer not to broadcast such info on here, but just putting in my tuppence for others to consider!

[StackemHigh]

I put mine up just for fun Pete,my average for this year was close on £70 per oz until I bought a few Kook proof sets kilo and 10ozers which pulled it down to £48 or so.

To be perfectly honest I don't care what my average is, because I enjoy the proof coins I buy and unfortunately the coins I buy cost bigtime and spot price has no relevance to them whatsoever.

 

That's the way forward for me mbz. going for quality over quantity. My stacking may well be  PAMP bars when i only have a few £ burning a hole in my wallet.

[Keithoil]

I agree with the point you make about having a landed price that includes everything tax etc.

 

If you do not add this to you average £/oz then you are only kidding one person yourself, and in 10 years time your stack will probably have cost you 20% more than you actually state.

 

Mine is 1613 and my average £/oz is £18.72, my average £/coin is £20.69.

 

This takes in to account any coin in my collection including the 1kg bar and the .3oz £1 coins etc. 

 

I like the NGC coins and I pay a premium on them but to try and offset a purchase of several of these I like an order from STG, and the average price £/oz tumbles down.

[Cornishfarmer]

It's got to be price to door/oz, quite new to this and only have 150 oz so splitting mine in to 3

1) collectors coins that won't sell ie ms70 pandas, nuie disney etc £60/oz

2) semi numi/bullion that hope to sell in 5 years for a huge profit, lunars and pandas £21.58oz

3)bullion that happy to sell scrap ie crocs phils maples £15.30/oz

[StackemHigh]

And it has to be the average of the whole stack. Can't miss a bit out sayin i'm not puting those into my £/oz cause it makes it higher!

[Keithoil]

@SeH

 

Agreed it has to be the whole stack, all coins / bars etc no exceptions.

 

Whether the 1oz lunar horse cost you £3 delivered or £333, it all has to go into the £/oz pot.

[Cornishfarmer]

And it has to be the average of the whole stack. Can't miss a bit out sayin i'm not puting those into my £/oz cause it makes it higher!

Rubbish, 2 are investments one is a hobby, if I buy the mrs a gold ring or silver earrings I'm not going to add that to my average because it's a separate entity

[motorbikez]

Rubbish, 2 are investments one is a hobby, if I buy the mrs a gold ring or silver earrings I'm not going to add that to my average because it's a separate entity

 

At the end of the day CF you can do what you want but the general consensus is you include everything in your stack or its a pointless exercise,obviously your wife's jewellery isn't part of your stack I hope

[Danny-boy]

There is no way of creating a level playing field, there are too many variables.

I may be at £25/oz with 220oz but I'll bet my stack is worth more than somebody who is at 220oz with regular bullion.

If I sold my entire stack for it's market value (granted it would take time and amass fees), I'd be 3/4 of the way to a monster box and could boast a £14.25/oz average.

But I like what I have and I'm keeping it, although a sealed MB is very tempting.

[Keithoil]

@ CF

 

Yes that is right you would not add things in like that.

 

I have bought some silver Christmas decorations, they do not go into my collection as the are Christmas decorations like any other decoration.

Keith

[silversword]

How people want to view their average is really up to them. Frankly if you are buying for investment then yes, cost really matters and you should calculate it honestly and accurately or you will end up not having a true reflection of how it has performed and whether you are profitable or not.

[HawkHybrid]

add whatever makes sense, it's not really a competition to get the lowest

£/oz as that mostly means you have lots of junk/bullion that would fetch

lower prices when you come to selling it. there are better value items, but

you do get mostly what you pay for, unless you get seriously lucky and

find a rare.

 

the £/oz should be used to help gauge things like, would I make more profit

buying maples or buying pandas. most of us buy from similar good value

online shops so the difference in £/oz for 2 similar stacks is small and give

little to no bragging rights.

 

HH

[Cornishfarmer]

@ CF

 

Yes that is right you would not add things in like that.

 

I have bought some silver Christmas decorations, they do not go into my collection as the are Christmas decorations like any other decoration.

Keith

This I what I mean, wife has handbags, scarves, shoes dresses, hair cuts, pampering....... The list goes on.

My pleasure is finding a deal on a nice slabbed coin that I don't consider being part of my stack like your decorations

[Danny-boy]

Out of interest guys, what is the thoughts around gifts?

I know my mom has recently bought me a 16x1oz sterling coin set (don't know what it is).

I think I'd feel a bit "cheaty" adding into my spreadsheet as zero thus reducing my £/oz.

What would you do?

[silversword]

If an ounce cost you £20 you'd make an entry for £20. If it cost you £1, you would still put £1 and congratulate yourself on a bargain, right? So if it was of no cost to you, then £0.00 is what you have to enter.

 

I make no apologies for quoting myself - I still stand by it. It's all about the cost to acquire, and if the cost was £0...

[Pete]

I make no apologies for quoting myself - I still stand by it. It's all about the cost to acquire, and if the cost was £0...

Correct - your landed total cost divided by weight gives your true average.

Stackers and collectors may wish to separate their bullion from their proofs and numis.

I cannot see any merit in having an average for collectors pieces as each will have its own value and there is a huge variation in prices per item.

Bullion however is another matter and having an average is a good thing for comparison with fellow stackers.

If your average is higher than most then that might get you curious as to the reasons.

Maybe you are not buying from the cheapest sources ?

Maybe as bullion you are buying the higher prices coins and thought you were buying cheaper ?

Etc.

If your average is below others then that might make you smile ?

[Cornishfarmer]

Out of interest guys, what is the thoughts around gifts?

I know my mom has recently bought me a 16x1oz sterling coin set (don't know what it is).

I think I'd feel a bit "cheaty" adding into my spreadsheet as zero thus reducing my £/oz.

What would you do?

Got to be £0 What's mother after is the question I'd be asking? House painted? Lift to airport?

[Danny-boy]

Got to be £0 What's mother after is the question I'd be asking? House painted? Lift to airport?

The old man just passed away so I have taken over all his jobs (changing bulbs, rubbish out, car maintenance etc) so I think she's just trying to pay it back.

Dying to know what it is. She bought at auction so all I know is it's sterling and 16 crown sized coins in the set. Arghhh

[Cornishfarmer]

Sorry to hear your loss, hope it's not a Christmas pressy!!!

[Danny-boy]

Sorry to hear your loss, hope it's not a Christmas pressy!!!

Cheers mate, it was 3 months today actually.

All good now though, returning to normal.

I bloody hope it's not a Xmas gift but I wouldn't put it past her!!!

[Richardski]

Just bought a 650 gram sterling silver trophy from cash converters for £190 incl postage which is around £40 below spot.

 

My overall average is now down to just under £15 as I've been purchasing quite a lot of "junk silver". Would prefer it all to be in coins - but I suppose silver is silver.

 

Have to make a trip to the smelter one day I suppose - no running away with bracelets and trophies and teapots under my shirt when being chased by the mob when the economies collapse lol.