Storing PMs

[Shamatti]

I currently have a Safety deposit box, which is not great for access to your stack, but brilliant for security. And also insurance.

 

When I get back to the UK I would be looking for a safety deposit box - does anyone haveany experience? Can you reccomend a specific bank or any other supplier?

 

I have read too many horror stories about home [un]-safes being broken in to to store my stack in a home safe. They are just an invitation to get robbed.

 

I did a year of locksmith training,l and I reccon I could get into your average home safe in under 10 minutes if I had my tools with me. Your average crook with a crow bar and a lump hammer would probably get in quicker than that!

 

Don't keep your stuff at home friends! There was one guy here in Aust had 75 Kilos of silver and I can't remember how many dozens of ounces of gold stolen from his home safe on New Years eve. Heartbreaking!

 

[Danny-boy]

Very few banks in the UK have SDB's nowadays.

When I was looking, it was private companies that provide this facility.

Expensive isn't the word, I wouldn't consider it for anything worth under 100k.

[Danny-boy]

BTW, you'd not be able to find my safe even if I gave you a day unhindered.

[Shamatti]

BTW, you'd not be able to find my safe even if I gave you a day unhindered.

 

Bet you a pint I could! lol

 

[Shamatti]

Here is the story.

 

Please don't let this happen to you!

 

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-01-01/wheelie-bin-used-to-steal-bullion-from-a-brisbane-home/5181294

[Danny-boy]

Have read that before, very sad. These things happen but not very often I reckon.

My safe is safe.

[ChrisSilver]

Most UK bank branches have stopped offering safe deposit boxes.

However, Metro Bank has safe deposit boxes at very low prices. It is a new bank to spring up in the UK, opened by a US guy. Though I don't think there will be any insurance in case of a break in. You won't be able to prove what was in the box as contents aren't logged or itemised.

I personally don't trust the banking system.

 

You can store your bullion with a specialist bullion vault company rather than a safe deposit box, then your bullion will be segregated and fully insured as the contents will be itemised. Though it won't be as easily accessible as a safe deposit box and there might be fees each time you want to add or remove something as there will be admin work involved, you have to check with each company as they all have different rules & charges etc.

 

There are several safe deposit box companies in London that operate safe deposit boxes, but they have been recently raided by police and customers having nightmares with the police and taking months to get they property back even though it is legitimately theirs.

 

I think storing at home is pretty safe, depends how much stuff you have and whereabouts you keep it. And also the area you live in. A burglary in my area would be responded to by police pretty quickly, but that's also because the neighbours are police themselves. 

Some people also have decoy safes, relatively easy to break into and a small amount of cash / plated gold coins etc, so someone breaking in would the decoy safe, take around 5-10mins to break into it, see some cash and coins, and take it and run. 

 

If you find a good company let the forum know the costs and conditions etc, maybe some other stackers also want to keep their stacks in safe deposit boxes. 

When you come to the UK what area will you be moving to? London?

[Dave]

You have to think outside the box re pms at home , look for everyday household items and fixtures , the kicker board under your kitchen units , putting a false back or base inside an existing unit, a plastic water tank and lid in the loft with dummy pipes, a 4"plastic stench/ stack pipe fitted to a utility room wall with end blocks , it's all there , the more normal and common it looks , the better

[Shamatti]

Interteting. I asked my dad about this - he lives in Cornwall - and he said it was a sort topic at the moment. His bank recently contacted him with 30 days to emopty his safety deposit box as they were withdrawing the service. Hmmm. Looks like my building and locksmithing skills will be coming in to play when I get home. lol

 

I will be moiving to Devon, I hope. Still need to find a place to live when we get there. Luckily I am a trained welder, and a pretty handy DIYer. I reccon I could conceal a safe quite easily, especially as we are looking for a place to purchase a little cheaper and then renovate.

 

Thanks for the input everyone. I will keep looking, but don't hold out much hope after hearing replies here, and from my dad. :/

[Danny-boy]

I tell you what, big old safes go quite cheap on eBay due to logistics.

I want a big cast one!!

[Sam]

You can store precious metals in our vault in Guernsey. There's an added benefit with silver, platinum and palladium as no VAT in Guernsey. An online account is set up where holding value/transactions etc can be viewed. Fully allocated and insured, with third party audits carried out on the contents quarterly (we publish these audits for clients to see). The metal remains the property of the owner and never moves onto our business balance sheet (it is held by a seperate nominee company) and can be shipped to the owner or collected from our office.

[DogSoldier1973]

It's like anything else in life.....you get what you pay for. Don't buy a cheap safe! buy one that is rated for what you are going to keep in it and bolt it down and box it in Get insurance and keep ALL receipts and then in the very unlikely event a thief could get past your security alarms, disable the security cameras with mobile alerts, dodge the dog, gain access to where the safe is, find your safe, spend the time to get access to the safe, break in to it (because you're not moving it unless you've got a couple of days to spare) and then get out again without being shot by a shotgun, ravaged by the dog and buried in a shallow grave somewhere on the moors....you're still covered by the insurance!   and that's just the dummy safe!

[Pete]

Assuming you have a safe or other means of hiding your stack, do you include it on your contents insurance ?

You can easily insure valuables up to a limit but would a monster box count as one item or a roll of Kooks as one item ?

Serious stackers might not have insurance as this could be either impossible to get or very expensive.

A large dog or a shotgun licence are possible alternatives - what do you think ?

[ChrisSilver]

What a lot of people do is have a small amount of PMs at home in a safe. And a large part of their holdings in allocated storage somewhere.

[Cointreau]

What a lot of people do is have a small amount of PMs at home in a safe. And a large part of their holdings in allocated storage somewhere.

I think I have too much at home and not enough in allocated storage. My safe is full of bricks. Wouldn't like to carry it down three flights of stairs.

It was hard enough carrying it up empty. Of course these safes can be cut into. I also keep my PM receipts in my locker at work. Rather there than at home.

[Cointreau]

You can store precious metals in our vault in Guernsey. There's an added benefit with silver, platinum and palladium as no VAT in Guernsey. An online account is set up where holding value/transactions etc can be viewed. Fully allocated and insured, with third party audits carried out on the contents quarterly (we publish these audits for clients to see). The metal remains the property of the owner and never moves onto our business balance sheet (it is held by a seperate nominee company) and can be shipped to the owner or collected from our office.

Hi Sam. Could we purchase your coins and have you store them in your vault? Or is it just gold and silver bars you put in storage?

Also, is the stored metal outside the reach of the UK Government?

[Danny-boy]

I guess it's down to effort - for the thief that is.

The harder you make it, the better.

Most thieves in the UK are after a TV & blu-Ray for £50 to buy some drugs, most won't go to any effort.

Some will, they're the ones you need to watch.

[Sam]

Hi Sam. Could we purchase your coins and have you store them in your vault? Or is it just gold and silver bars you put in storage?

Also, is the stored metal outside the reach of the UK Government?

Hi Cointreau, yes, all we require is an account application form and proof of identity/address. We calculate our charges on the weight of the metal, so don't mind if it's coins or bars. Our minimum charge is $10 per month (or around £6). Guernsey is not part of the UK or EU. Thanks.

[Pipers]

I think we should be careful what we say about storage on an open platform. Thieves may well get ideas.

[SilverPirate]

Plastic paint pots are good air tight and looking nasty, put it among a lot of others and who would know. apart from it is heavy to lift but who would check it in a hurry.

[ChrisSilver]

I don't have that much silver, but I have a fair few coins, a nice small collection. And to be honest, even though it doesn't take up much space, I am already finding storage annoying.

A variety of different tubes, roles, and sized coins, mainly 1oz, but a few 10oz, and a couple of 1kg coins. They don't stack nicely at all.

Silver bars would be a much easier and nicer thing to stack. Just a load of 10oz stacker bars and they would fit all nicely in stacked columns. But then I wouldn't benefit from a potential semi numismatic increase in value.

To be honest I might start buying mostly gold instead, only need to buy a couple of 1oz coins a year and they would all fit nicely into a lighthouse case. Wouldn't have to worry about stacking them all on top of each other.

[Cointreau]

I'm two steps ahead of you Chris. I already got a decent stack of silver and gold. And because I'm not a homeowner my stack represents a sizeable share of my wealth.

So, as much as I love gold coins I am now looking to buy more of my metal through Goldmoney and 'internationalise' some of my wealth.

Mike Maloney is moving his metal out of his home. He is a different case mind, as it is widely known that he's a stacker. I will still buy the odd coin here and there though.

[ChrisSilver]

I'm two steps ahead of you Chris. I already got a decent stack of silver and gold. And because I'm not a homeowner my stack represents a sizeable share of my wealth.

So, as much as I love gold coins I am now looking to buy more of my metal through Goldmoney and 'internationalise' some of my wealth.

Mike Maloney is moving his metal out of his home. He is a different case mind, as it is widely known that he's a stacker. I will still buy the odd coin here and there though.

 

When I looked at it, bullionvalut was the better option. If you work out a scenario where gold prices doubled, or even quadrupled. The all round fees would be cheaper with bullionvault than goldmoney. An advantage of goldmoney is that you can actually send gold to people with account. The 3.99% fee for small gold purchases though is a bit steep!

I will eventually look into some allocated, and hopefully get one set up, but not until I have a sizable physical stack and have sufficient funds to invest into an allocated account to make the monthly storage cost minimal.

[Cointreau]

Granted, Goldmoney do charge a 4% fee but you probably pay a similar premium if you buy a gold coin here and if you buy silver you are getting it at near to spot price. Now, Bullionvault have a very very tight spread on their buy and sell exchange and if you're trading, then that makes them look very enticing. However, I'm pretty sure that Bullionvault store their metal in a London vault, and that is why I don't fully trust them. Do they really have the metal? And finally, Goldmoney's storage fees really are negligible. If you had a 1000 grams of gold in one their vaults then you would lose only one gram per year through storage fees.

[Sam]

Just a quick point on the storage topic. Check the hidden charges: cost if you want to pick up your bars/coins. Some of the big players in the market will charge you between 5 and 10%. We do not believe you should be charged to pick up what YOU OWN!