PM mining shares

[motorbikez]

motorbikez, on 09 Oct 2014 - 8:03 PM, said:

Have a look at HOC that has been slaughtered over the last year and is primarily a silver producer, the family I believe own at least 20% and have been engaging in cost cutting etc so could be due for a bounce.

 

I have held shares in them a number of years ago and did OK with them, I might be tempted with a small punt of a 1000 shares they are on my watch list.

 

I that Hochschild mining? I held them earlier this year and pulled a profit, if you want to see a miner that's been smashed check African Minerals, they've gone from 600 to 15, I watch it all day and the swings are wild, started out today down 20% and finished plus 3.33%, there maybe big money to be made there but also a chance of big losses.

 

Anyway tomorrow will be an interesting day for silver, it's gonna be all over the place.  

[motorbikez]

Hi garthy,

 

I just created this thread to carry on talking about mining shares I don't want to get a warning for high jacking another thread 

 

Re African Minerals,I know nothing about them and arn't into day trading as I haven't the funds to loose since the ex stitched me up for 250K

[garthy]

Hi MB

 

Yeah I had a feeling we were high jacking the thread, good idea to start this one.

 

African minerals are mainly a iron ore miner based in Sierra Leone and there lies the problem, iron ore's getting smashed and Sierra Leone is host to the ebola virus, if they find a cure the shares could rocket.

 

I'll keep an eye on fres tomorrow, it could be time to buy back in now that the fed have said they won't be raising rates, always good for gold and silver.

[FTYBR]

Whilst I have a large proportion of my wealth in mining, I'd suggest anyone dipping their toe in here, treads very carefully. I won't name particular stocks on a public forum for obvious reasons, but feel it's worth pointing out that...

over the next few years, as (paper) prices continue to get squeezed, miners are experiencing a slow death. We'll see more and more mining companies go under, or more likely be forced to issue more and more shares to raise funds at inappropriate prices (effectively killing off market cap/share price) but in doing so maintaining the salaries and lifestyles of the board. The security of the region is also massively important - there are situations in parts of South America and Africa where gold exports via land/sea are being hijacked. It's not sustainable it's putting even further pressure on margins. Companies affected dare not mention this for fear of share price capitulation/shareholder revolt. Far better to blame 'unforeseen circumstances'. Same is happening in the oil industry.

If you want exposure to mining and are relatively inexperienced - stick to mining funds (and junior mining funds) or ETF's where you're spreading your investments across 50-60 companies. Those who survive this battle will do very VERY well. Just make sure you sell out in time before governments nationalise/expropriate the licenses 'for national security'. (keep tin foil hats on at all times)

[Paul]

The whole area of mining shares & related industries within the stock market, to be truthful i don't know one thing about.

 

i have kept money out of the stock market personally

 

I have always been a cash, ISAs, bonds, premium bonds, tangible collectables/memorabilia, flippng items for a quick profit & in the past 4 years a good proportion of my wealth in precious metals

 

I don't think i will be the only stacker out there who would appreciate any basic advice or guidance of going into getting into mining shares.

FTYBR gives some excellent points.

 

I would assume certain precious metals miners/companies/share gains would far outstrip any gains many times over holding physical bullion.  As most of us are doing here

But as described above the downside risk and massive volatility is inherent in investing in them

 

It is just picking them that is the hard task i guess !

[motorbikez]

Paul I wouldn't advise anyone to buy a particular share mining or otherwise, I have invested in the stock markets for around 25 years very actively up until about 18 months ago and all I would say,is use your common sense and research research and research some more.

 

An interesting site to look at is http://www.iii.co.uk/community/ there are some very knowledgeable guys on there.By the same token there are some complete idiots and trolls with other agendas there as well,but you will soon suss out the guys with something intelligent and useful to say from the rest.

 

You could also set up a dummy trading account with someone like  http://www.digitallook.com/ I ran a dummy account with them for a while about 10 years ago for a bit of fun,at the time your portfolio was updated at close of business every day.They might still let you do that and it was free.

 

Best thing to do IMHO is take your time get a feel for things and see how it goes.Invest in things that interest you and you'll no doubt find it interesting and potentially rewarding pursuit .One thing I will say about mining shares if you don't have a strong stomach for risk or need your cash fast don't invest.If you are true investor rather than a trader you can ride out any falls.

 

For the record I now only hold 2 mining shares Fres and RRS ,my circumstances having altered drastically 18 months or so ago.

 

You could also dip your toes in the water with a monthly payment into an investment trust that specialises in mining stocks.

 

Good luck with it.

[garthy]

Some interesting stats on fresnillo, the biggest silver miner and one of the most cost effective, how much does it really cost to produce an ounce of silver and gold.

 

 

[motorbikez]

Thanks for posting Garthy, it just shows how tight things are getting for miners especially when Fresnillo is one of the most efficient primary silver miners in the world.

[motorbikez]

I bought a few more shares in Fres today, what I am liking at the moment is the big drop in fuel costs/diesel for the miners. I was toying with buying a couple of thousand shares in HOC but decided to add to my holding in Fres, the fuel cost drop will go straight to the bottom line, so efficient companies like Fres will if the the oil price stays low benefit enormously.

[garthy]

I bought a few more shares in Fres today, what I am liking at the moment is the big drop in fuel costs/diesel for the miners. I was toying with buying a couple of thousand shares in HOC but decided to add to my holding in Fres, the fuel cost drop will go straight to the bottom line, so efficient companies like Fres will if the the oil price stays low benefit enormously.

 

I went back into fres at 729 so doing ok up till now, though I was getting ready to pull out today as the markets started to turn around, I've a feeling PM's are going lower in the short term until the ECB decide on their QE program, but You're right the miners love these low oil prices, Mining stocks are becoming more and more contrary, but I like it that way.

 

I'm also considering BP PLC,  a bit risky short term but as far as I'm concerned oil prices aren't going to stay this low and BP have enough money to back stop these low prices, also they pay a decent dividend so I may for once hold for a while and see what happens.     

[Pete]

Here is my chart for my belief 3 years ago in the rise of gold and PMs.

This is Blackrock Gold & General Fund

 

 

[motorbikez]

A lot of PM mining stocks charts look very similar Pete as you are no doubt aware. Timing & a strong stomach are required for a hold and forget. I'm happy enough with my 7.87 top up yesterday. Re the Blackrock fund, might be one to pay into monthly as all producing miners will benefit from the low oil price regardless of whether Pms rise much or not.

[motorbikez]

Just sold my top up of 315 shares in Fres @ £8.56

[motorbikez]

Just sold 200 Fres @ £9.07 ahead of ECB QE  decision.

[shemyaza]

I'm quietly in Antofagasta which for me is a very strong Miner

[HawkHybrid]

I like how antofagasta was conservative and kept a good

amount in cash during the 2007 crisis. one of the better

strategies in my opinion.

 

HH

[motorbikez]

Try and keep on track guys antofagasta is a general mining co mainly mining copper not Pms.

[HighlandTiger]

Try and keep on track guys antofagasta is a general mining co mainly mining copper not Pms.

 

I thought that they also mined gold and silver as a by product of their copper mines?

[motorbikez]

I thought that they also mined gold and silver as a by product of their copper mines?

Yes they do but this thread is specifically as per title aimed at PM shares only if you want to start a thread about mining shares in general feel free to do so.

[HighlandTiger]

Yes they do but this thread is specifically as per title aimed at PM shares only if you want to start a thread about mining shares in general feel free to do so.

 

It's ok, I was just curious, that is all. I was just under the impression from reading on this forum and others, that a lot of the silver and gold mined every year comes as a by product from mining other metals or minerals etc

 

Don't own any mining shares, just interested that's all.

[motorbikez]

It's ok, I was just curious, that is all. I was just under the impression from reading on this forum and others, that a lot of the silver and gold mined every year comes as a by product from mining other metals or minerals etc

 

Don't own any mining shares, just interested that's all.

 

If you are genuinely interested have a look at digital look or similar internet financial websites a lot of them differentiate between General miners and PM miners.For instance BHP Billiton is the largest producer of silver in the world,but produces that as a by product of other mining activities it is also a world class oil production company but is also just part of its worldwide resources business and is not included in oil share indices.

[HighlandTiger]

Cheers mb. I'll check it out.

[paperponzi]

Had a chat with someone involved with mining startup the other night start getting gold out of the ground in a couple of years it will have been 15 years by that stage since company formed 6 million onces to come out,when I asked what all in production cost was she said $800 gave me food for thought 50% profit at this level ,from an investor point of view long time before it all comes to fruition and what pitfalls lie ahead .

[HawkHybrid]

people claim a lot of things until the actual figures

materialise. the g/tonne of recoverable gold is a

reasonable indicator of potential low cost mining.

as always, good management are critical for a

company's success.

 

HH

[HawkHybrid]

here's a question, you are given the choice of 2

companies A and B. both company have similar

debt, earnings ratio, quality of management etc.

only difference is company A has an all in gold

mining cost of $800/oz and for company B it's

$1200/oz.

 

if your aim is to make as much money as possible

between buying their shares, holding on to it and

then selling. which company do you choose?

 

HH