Britannia BU & Proofs + Photo Albums

[JohnA]

 I created photo albums for BU and Proof Britannia's. Links below.

BU => https://imgur.com/a/UVjxf

Proof => https://imgur.com/a/hZAIb

 

 

 

 

[HelpingHands]

From 2013 (I think) the bullion is the standing but the proof coins had different designs.

[NewMSmatist15]

On 1/29/2018 at 21:25, HelpingHands said:

From 2013 (I think) the bullion is the standing but the proof coins had different designs.

There's actually an uncirculated or "business strike" version of the 2013 that is listed on the NGC registry as a "seated Liberty" or sometimes I've seen "seated Britannia". I haven't found much about it other than it had a limited release similar to the plain fields versions with a mintage of 10,000 coins that have come out in tandem with the textured field versions with larger mintages.

Below is the top registry set for Britannia's and the collector has both the 2013 with the standing Britannia that is common and the seated one. The first screenshot shows there are two slots in the registry set and the second shows a screenshot of the coin in DPL. Not sure if anyone else knows abou this coin or has more information.

[JohnA]

@NewMSmatist15

Thanks. The Britannia design variation makes them more interesting to collect than Sovereigns for me.

I wish I could find a complete list with pictures of all Britannia designs.

[NewMSmatist15]

46 minutes ago, JohnAnsink said:

@NewMSmatist15

Thanks. The Britannia design variation makes them more interesting to collect than Sovereigns for me.

I wish I could find a complete list with pictures of all Britannia designs.

While it is not quite complete, but it is the most complete I've found, I'd say use the NGC registry site. NGC sees a lot of coins and they designate varieties and errors so they have more information than the common collector. There's also a book called "Silver Coins Bullion Book" by Sebastian Wieshowski which I first heard about on @Numistacker's YouTube channel. It does a good job of listing and describing most modern bullion collectibles - referred to as semi-numismatics on this forum and in other outlets - but stops at year 2012 for the Britannia in terms of mintages and information on design. It briefly mentions the most recent versions with the textured fields, but lacks information on the varieties.

The notable varieties are the 2011 matte, the 2013 seated, and the 2014 mule error. I only learned about the 2013 seated because of the registry sets. I collect Britannias and try to get as much info on them as possible, but it is very difficult. I think there is more information and completeness when it comes to collecting the proof designs. I think the Royal Mint might have assumed collectors weren't interested in the business strike versions as anything more than bullion investment. I even emailed the Royal Mint a few times and couldn't get information from them, not even a response.

If you know of any sources or found other books, @JohnAnsink, I'd be interested in hearing about them!

[JohnA]

Oh..so I can look up a registry set and then view the coins that way. Thanks @NewMSmatist15

https://coins.www.collectors-society.com/registry/coins/SetListing.aspx?PeopleSetID=195725

I'm going to create an image album of all the years, MS and Proof

Editing original post

[HelpingHands]

@JohnAnsink We have a gallery on here

http://thesilverforum.com/gallery/category/3-silver-bu/

BU

 

[JohnA]

1 minute ago, HelpingHands said:

@JohnAnsink We have a gallery on here

http://thesilverforum.com/gallery/category/3-silver-bu/

BU

 

Ok...I'm not a premium member 

[JohnA]

I have the silver 1997 Proof set..going to NGC soon...After doing these albums and seeing the beautiful designs in Proofs, I am debating whether I should go for 1/10 oz gold proofs or 1 oz silver. I thought I had my mind made up. But maybe not   

[HelpingHands]

@ChrisSIlver do you need to be premium to view the gallery?

[richatthecroft]

Interesting reading in this topic.  I too collect Britannia Coins, and any resource is fab, but only came to Britannia's by accident as there was an apparently 'unloved' small 'run'- of one ounce, 2011, 12 & 13 that were very reasonably priced, here on the Forum for sale, so bought them.  I have been captivated ever since, they are truly wonderful coins.  

My original plan several months ago was to invest in PM's, in terms of 'stacking' as close to spot as possible and vowed to myself that I could never get emotionally attached to something like a coin.  Although I have many bars, and find them interesting   I'm now 'hooked' into several series of coins, my main interests, the Britannia's but also now collecting the Provident Metals Egyptian Gods series, Queen's Beasts and old Peace Dollars.  Recently, I have now found myself buying 'Britannia like coins' (if there is such a thing!), the recent Isle of Man Britannia Rules the Waves, 'The first £50 coin', in fact any coin with a lady on it or a themed and stylized horse! there's a wonderful 'Modern Ancients' silver round that I have on my list depicting Pegasus, but I digress.    

As opposed to many, I'm not put off by odd dings, the odd scratch as I find they add a bit of character and (fortunately!) I am endeared to tarnishing, some of the tarnished Britannia's look fab, I have a wonderful looking 2000 Britannia that is heavily tarnished everywhere, both sides excepting Britannia herself, wonderful!

What I am struggling with is Privy Marks.  I get them and the concept, but don't really feel motivated to buy, as their is no real added value in my (novice) eyes.  Proofs I'll probably stay clear from, and not yet ready to think about fractional Britannia's (apart from Gold ones).  I do acknowledge however, this might change, once I have collected the bulk/ all of them. 

I have a couple of questions for any Britannia collectors out there:

1) 2004 through to 2007 there is an apparent dearth of availability of Britannia coins, which I cannot understand as mintage of the BU coins apparently increased but yet supply is slow and premiums high. 

2) Another question has been answered, in terms of some reading suggestions.

3) Is it absolute sacrilege to peel a Britannia coin from its 'presentation' card (I have a fab sealed 2008 coin and then sealed again by the Royal Mint presumably for transit) that I'm desperate to liberate so that it might be able to sit in my silver stash box with the others, and have recently bought another on a card, does the card really add value? It's an annoyance to me! Maybe someone would like to swap there BU 'uncarded' coin with me, or perhaps I should collect another?

Lastly, I would like to buy a nice presentation box, I've seen a German made Britannia Box, that fits 20 coins, but this is restrictive if I collect multiple years in terms of the Privy's for example, what coin boxes/ cases do others use?

[motorbikez]

@richatthecroft 1 no idea  although 2005 & 2007 are fab designs IMHO

                             3 no its not sacrilege  to remove from a card I did that myself as I couldn't find one in a capsule.

                            I use coin trays for most of my collection. Like below .

 

[richatthecroft]

Jeez, lovely collection, they look great in the tray I have a way to go yet.  Where are those scissors...hate the cards! 

[NewMSmatist15]

16 hours ago, JohnAnsink said:

I have the silver 1997 Proof set..going to NGC soon...After doing these albums and seeing the beautiful designs in Proofs, I am debating whether I should go for 1/10 oz gold proofs or 1 oz silver. I thought I had my mind made up. But maybe not   

I don't collect the proof versions myself, but the size of a 1 ounce coin is much better for viewing the designs. Gold is probably more stable in terms of price. I have business strike silver 1 ounce coins in this series myself and really love them, even the ones where the design hasn't changed. They just appeal to me more than an ASE, CML, or Panda.

[NewMSmatist15]

16 hours ago, richatthecroft said:

Interesting reading in this topic.  I too collect Britannia Coins, and any resource is fab, but only came to Britannia's by accident as there was an apparently 'unloved' small 'run'- of one ounce, 2011, 12 & 13 that were very reasonably priced, here on the Forum for sale, so bought them.  I have been captivated ever since, they are truly wonderful coins.  

My original plan several months ago was to invest in PM's, in terms of 'stacking' as close to spot as possible and vowed to myself that I could never get emotionally attached to something like a coin.  Although I have many bars, and find them interesting   I'm now 'hooked' into several series of coins, my main interests, the Britannia's but also now collecting the Provident Metals Egyptian Gods series, Queen's Beasts and old Peace Dollars.  Recently, I have now found myself buying 'Britannia like coins' (if there is such a thing!), the recent Isle of Man Britannia Rules the Waves, 'The first £50 coin', in fact any coin with a lady on it or a themed and stylized horse! there's a wonderful 'Modern Ancients' silver round that I have on my list depicting Pegasus, but I digress.    

As opposed to many, I'm not put off by odd dings, the odd scratch as I find they add a bit of character and (fortunately!) I am endeared to tarnishing, some of the tarnished Britannia's look fab, I have a wonderful looking 2000 Britannia that is heavily tarnished everywhere, both sides excepting Britannia herself, wonderful!

What I am struggling with is Privy Marks.  I get them and the concept, but don't really feel motivated to buy, as their is no real added value in my (novice) eyes.  Proofs I'll probably stay clear from, and not yet ready to think about fractional Britannia's (apart from Gold ones).  I do acknowledge however, this might change, once I have collected the bulk/ all of them. 

I have a couple of questions for any Britannia collectors out there:

1) 2004 through to 2007 there is an apparent dearth of availability of Britannia coins, which I cannot understand as mintage of the BU coins apparently increased but yet supply is slow and premiums high. 

2) Another question has been answered, in terms of some reading suggestions.

3) Is it absolute sacrilege to peel a Britannia coin from its 'presentation' card (I have a fab sealed 2008 coin and then sealed again by the Royal Mint presumably for transit) that I'm desperate to liberate so that it might be able to sit in my silver stash box with the others, and have recently bought another on a card, does the card really add value? It's an annoyance to me! Maybe someone would like to swap there BU 'uncarded' coin with me, or perhaps I should collect another?

Lastly, I would like to buy a nice presentation box, I've seen a German made Britannia Box, that fits 20 coins, but this is restrictive if I collect multiple years in terms of the Privy's for example, what coin boxes/ cases do others use?

If you're interested in Britannia "like" coins the two you mentioned are nice. I also own a 2015 50 pound Britannia coin as the design is the same as the 2014 silver 1 ounce proof. There are also the "shipwreck" Britannia coins that come in 1/4 ounce of silver (these are small coins) and have edge lettering saying Gairsoppa which is the name of a 1919 ship that sunk and silver was recovered from to strike these coins. There are two years of these. There is a 2 pound bimetallic Britannia coin which was first issued in 2015 for circulation. It is not a precious metal coin, but the design is similar to the 2015 proof design on the silver ounce version. I have some graded and love this coin. It comes in a gilt and piedfort version that are PM. Finally, there are images of Britannia on British currency from history you might like. I know for a long run Britannia is featured on the circulating 50 pence and this coin is also available in silver proof versions. I like the heptagon shape and the size of a 50p is nice.

1. Agreed. 2004 is a "hard to find" issue. I think it is for two reasons. a) It is one of the early strikes of the coin so there are probably less available since anyone who collects these might already have it and is holding onto it. b) It is a year where the design didn't alternate. I've noticed the alternating designs go up for sale more often than others maybe because of a perceived scarcity or uniqueness. 2004 and 2006 I think are more difficult to acquire than 2005 and 2007. That being said I'm hunting for a 2007 myself. I only collect graded versions and have a registry set myself on NGC. Looking for a quality graded example is far more difficult than just getting a coin for that year.

2. I wish there were more reading and books available!

3. Not sure, but I know if a collector is going to take a chance on grading a coin having it in OMP is better than seeing it in a capsule in someone's collection. That's what I would think.

Can't help on a presentation box, sorry!

[NewMSmatist15]

16 hours ago, HelpingHands said:

@ChrisSIlver do you need to be premium to view the gallery?

Seems that way, I couldn't access that gallery either.

[motorbikez]

@NewMSmatist15 @richatthecroft @JohnAnsink

 

Here's my video on Bu Britannias

 

 

[JohnA]

@motorbikez

Nice video. I subbed. I was worried about milk spots. How do the BU coins do over time? I had a Horse Privy and that spotted up.

And how do the 1 oz Proofs stand up? I know that my 1997 Proof set has discoloration on the fractional coins because they were stored with foam rings which must have given off a gas.

[airmac]

6 hours ago, JohnAnsink said:

@motorbikez

Nice video. I subbed. I was worried about milk spots. How do the BU coins do over time? I had a Horse Privy and that spotted up.

And how do the 1 oz Proofs stand up? I know that my 1997 Proof set has discoloration on the fractional coins because they were stored with foam rings which must have given off a gas.

I had a 1 oz sent to NGC that was discolored. Went to NGC and got a 70 still

[motorbikez]

@JohnAnsink I haven't got any Bu's with milkspots 2011 has a bit of fogging the rest are mint, I have them all in US made airtites.

I only have  8   1oz proofs & all are perfect. Plus half a dozen slabbed which are also perfect.

[richatthecroft]

On ‎01‎/‎02‎/‎2018 at 18:33, NewMSmatist15 said:

If you're interested in Britannia "like" coins the two you mentioned are nice. I also own a 2015 50 pound Britannia coin as the design is the same as the 2014 silver 1 ounce proof. There are also the "shipwreck" Britannia coins that come in 1/4 ounce of silver (these are small coins) and have edge lettering saying Gairsoppa which is the name of a 1919 ship that sunk and silver was recovered from to strike these coins. There are two years of these. There is a 2 pound bimetallic Britannia coin which was first issued in 2015 for circulation. It is not a precious metal coin, but the design is similar to the 2015 proof design on the silver ounce version. I have some graded and love this coin. It comes in a gilt and piedfort version that are PM. Finally, there are images of Britannia on British currency from history you might like. I know for a long run Britannia is featured on the circulating 50 pence and this coin is also available in silver proof versions. I like the heptagon shape and the size of a 50p is nice.

1. Agreed. 2004 is a "hard to find" issue. I think it is for two reasons. a) It is one of the early strikes of the coin so there are probably less available since anyone who collects these might already have it and is holding onto it. It is a year where the design didn't alternate. I've noticed the alternating designs go up for sale more often than others maybe because of a perceived scarcity or uniqueness. 2004 and 2006 I think are more difficult to acquire than 2005 and 2007. That being said I'm hunting for a 2007 myself. I only collect graded versions and have a registry set myself on NGC. Looking for a quality graded example is far more difficult than just getting a coin for that year.

2. I wish there were more reading and books available!

3. Not sure, but I know if a collector is going to take a chance on grading a coin having it in OMP is better than seeing it in a capsule in someone's collection. That's what I would think.

Can't help on a presentation box, sorry!

Sorry for belated response.  I too bought the £50 Britannia! Gorgeous coin! I think I need to familiarise myself with the fractional coins a little bit more before I set out to invest, but the 1/4oz coins are of interest particularly the shipwreck silver one.  I wouldn't be averse to the bimetallic coins, I own a circulated but in great condition £2 Britannia design coin which is one of my favourites that a friend gave me and which she picked up in her change!

Thank you for shedding light on the theory of the 'hard to find' issues, and particularly the 2004 and 2006 being tricky to acquire.  I'm fortunate that I already  have the 2004, and only just today, acquired 1999, 2002, 2003, 2005 & 2006 from a forum member today in one go, so leaves me only the 2001 & like you, the 2007!  Don't know quite know what to do about the 1997 as it was pointed out to me that this coin was Proof only, so I guess buying a proof set will have to be something I'll have to think about unless there were one ounce coins individually sold as Proof?  More reading would be great!  I'll have to take my chances on future value in terms of liberating the coins from the cards, I simply don't like the cards!

 

[JohnA]

@richatthecroft

I bought a 1997 proof set and apparently back then the RM used foam rings on the small coins that discolored them. I am getting them conserved next month and we'll see how they come out. The color is only on the face side since that was stored down. The 1 oz only has a very slight color since it had no foam ring in holder. I think the foam released a gas. 

Anyway, there are sets and individual coins on eBay and probably around other places

 

[motorbikez]

@richatthecroft There were 1997 1oz proofs issued as singles but they are pretty expensive. You don't really need that coin to complete a Bu set though as there were no 1997 Bu's.

[richatthecroft]

1 hour ago, motorbikez said:

@richatthecroft There were 1997 1oz proofs issued as singles but they are pretty expensive. You don't really need that coin to complete a Bu set though as there were no 1997 Bu's.

Mmmm, I guess your right about the fact that if collecting BU Britannia's then 1998 through to current issue and beyond would be kind of 'near enough' however, if I wanted to have the full run of them, then it would make sense to own a 1997 Silver Britannia.  My reason being, that if showing the collection off,  and providing commentary and information of them to an interested party (I'm thinking of my very inquisitive father-in-law here!) then you would reach the 2017 issue and explain it as the 20th Anniversary Edition then the observant person would question where the 1997 coin was!  Having said all of the above, I wouldn't lose any sleep whatsoever in terms of an absent 1997 coin!

My own personal decision/ answer to this conundrum in terms of my collection is as follows: I wouldn't feel right and so would never 'plunder' a set of proof coins for the 1oz coin and move on the remainder, even if in the unlikely event I stumbled upon a reasonably priced set.  I certainly wouldn't pay a massive amount of premium to own a single Proof 1oz. Therefore, my solution would be buying a 1997 Gold Britannia coin even a 1/4 ounce version, to simply exemplify that years design, the premium being way, way less than the silver proof.  

Just my solution to very much a first world problem! 

 

 

[JohnA]

I have this dilemma too. But pricing the older BU coins that have different designs shows that buying a proof version is not that much more for what I get. The proofs I think will hold up better. I am going to just concentrate on the proof varied designs and not the common standing Britannia. But also there are some BU modern that are nice, like the Oriental Border.