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JohnAnsink

eBay & Coin Market Values

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What drives the value of coins for resale? Is it eBay or large dealers like Apmex, etc? I see some price guides or NGC and PCGS that have prices much higher than the market. And non-eBay auctions are usually higher too.

Does eBay have a good or bad effect on coin prices? What was it like before the rise of online marketplace and auctions? Has it driven the resale prices higher than before or lower with more competition? 

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Im not from the states but I buy and sell a lot with an increasing presence on eBay. 

I built my business model on beating eBay. The way forward is to buy peer to peer, but when buying coins on eBay, the real issue is the fees. I can sell on eBay for the benchmark BIN price and make more money but to me it doesnt feel right to do so. What you need to consider is that I don't pay VAT (yet) as soon as I add it on the chances are its not greed on the sellers behalf but ebays. 

Just my 2 cents

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33 minutes ago, oliversw5 said:

Im not from the states but I buy and sell a lot with an increasing presence on eBay. 

I built my business model on beating eBay. The way forward is to buy peer to peer, but when buying coins on eBay, the real issue is the fees. I can sell on eBay for the benchmark BIN price and make more money but to me it doesnt feel right to do so. What you need to consider is that I don't pay VAT (yet) as soon as I add it on the chances are its not greed on the sellers behalf but ebays. 

Just my 2 cents

What's the BIN benchmark?

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The BUY IT NOW benchmark is the price that dealers will price at, on new coins the price is very narrow as competition is hot. On old coins the BIN benchmark is very wide. the benchmark has validity though because people who are not professional sellers will always price near a professional price (or they should be).

I will add to this actually. With new coins, if you price above the benchmark you probably won't sell. As an individual wanting to sell on eBay you need to come under just under the benchmark to sell a coin. Why would someone buy from a member of the public when they can buy from a well respected dealer at the same price? your reputation as a dealer is paramount and people will gravitate towards you. The price is a constant tandem of different market forces, such as spot price, competition and competitive advantage. A dealer can only come down so much in price before it harms not only himself but all the other dealers involved. For an individual to really pick up a bargain I would suggest an auction or buying peer to peer. If you are paying the BUY IT NOW price you are paying spot plus manufacturing plus dealers cut plus postage, that is for new coins. 

With old coins, dealers have more sway over price and will charge a higher mark. This is done because backdated coins in good condition are hard to find. I often buy from dealers the world over and try and 'bully' them into getting the best price possible. I charge a higher mark up because firstly its higher risk for me, the reason the dealers will sell in large is because its left over stock they can't shift on most occasions and secondly as long as I stick to the BIN benchmark set by others my mark up is determined by the skill I have in getting the price I want.

Going back to the original posters question. Value is a spectrum, there is no such thing as a price but a spectrum of prices that one can buy at. At one end is Ebay and the other end is peer to peer with everything in-between (such as online dealers, auctions, antiques etc etc), its not eBay is expensive as its relative. In your case you are looking in the wrong place as you are after value, eBay simply provides a mechanism for buyers and sellers and charges a fee on top. Not everyone is an investor and some people will see it as money spent and not expect a return on a coin whatsoever. 

Edited by oliversw5

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Ebay is the best place to buy coins for me.Dealers always ask more money for the real value/condition of the coin but with my patience and perseverance I have managed to buy for less money and better condition from ordinary people :);).

PCGS prices are in dollars if I`m right and you would have to convert in your own currency.I find the PCGS price guide quite right but prices can fluctuate drastically over a short time.

Regarding the re-sale price on Ebay. The difference in price,let`s say for an MS69 to MS70 is huge.With older coins ,even toning and a good strike attracts more money.Some people over price their coins because they are greedy or have no idea what the real value and condition of the coin is.Compared with last year,on Ebay,there are less coins for sale and in worse condition.

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3 hours ago, JohnAnsink said:

@oliversw5 

I try to buy from  big dealers, like Apmex or Provident, but if I can't find there I will go to eBay and find a large seller there. One with high rating

I wish I have big dealers like Apmex or Provident here in UK.I think I will buy some graded pre-1933 coins from Apmex by end of year.I also hope I wont be charged with VAT by the ''Pirates''

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25 minutes ago, Alex said:

I wish I have big dealers like Apmex or Provident here in UK.I think I will buy some graded pre-1933 coins from Apmex by end of year.I also hope I wont be charged with VAT by the ''Pirates''

Provident has good prices for bullion...and a lot of these have free shipping for $100 purchase. 

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1 hour ago, Alex said:

I wish I have big dealers like Apmex or Provident here in UK.I think I will buy some graded pre-1933 coins from Apmex by end of year.I also hope I wont be charged with VAT by the ''Pirates''

I've only begun buying from the US in the last year. 4 times it was all gold, twice I had to send a declaration form to declare it was investment gold and the other 2 times it just arrived - nothing extra to pay in all cases. The only problem is on silver and/or mixing a silver/gold order.

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For modern coins and bullion its usually better to source closest to the mint as possible, large dealers are best. ebay auctions can be cheaper than large dealers through seller inexperience. ebay large dealer sales can be good or even the best when there is an ebay promotion on. 

Sellers of high grade coins do not want to sell at auction on ebay its too risky. There often is not enough buyers for specialised items and so they use BIN to have some control over margins. Sellers of low grade or problem coins will use auctions much more than BIN so if you buy using ebay auctions you are more likely to get a dud though there are many exceptions. 

The best places to buy and sell are facebook groups and this forum but sometimes even here the volume of people is not great enough to ensure quick liquidity so it is necessary to use more traditional channels.

I have seen prices here on this forum that are crazy and then of course items dont get sold. Why members would price items at large premiums and then say to fellow forum members PP FF only or plus 4% for PPG is beyond me when they are asking as much as ebay which has 10-15% cost built in.

 

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4 hours ago, metallica73 said:

I've only begun buying from the US in the last year. 4 times it was all gold, twice I had to send a declaration form to declare it was investment gold and the other 2 times it just arrived - nothing extra to pay in all cases. The only problem is on silver and/or mixing a silver/gold order.

If that`s the case then I won`t buy Queens beast.I`ll buy all the indian heads plus one buffalo or St Gaudens.I can`t wait :)

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1 hour ago, Numistacker said:

 

The best places to buy and sell are facebook groups 

 

I never even thought of that for coins. I sell some household goods on facebook in a local buy/sell site. I'll search for a local coin site.

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1 hour ago, Numistacker said:

 

I have seen prices here on this forum that are crazy and then of course items dont get sold. Why members would price items at large premiums and then say to fellow forum members PP FF only or plus 4% for PPG is beyond me when they are asking as much as ebay which has 10-15% cost built in.

 

I would not send money through PP FF just to save 10 pounds.I can get the same product for a bit more from reputable dealers.

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Me to, ive spent £1000's on here all f&f.

 

Just sent money to a member on here Paypal F&F. I was then told it had been sent as an E-cheque for some unknown reason. The funds are not available until 22nd but the seller checks my feedback & repuation & has agreed to send tomorrow. Thats how we like it on here

 

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9 hours ago, metallica73 said:

I've only begun buying from the US in the last year. 4 times it was all gold, twice I had to send a declaration form to declare it was investment gold and the other 2 times it just arrived - nothing extra to pay in all cases. The only problem is on silver and/or mixing a silver/gold order.

I purchased two 1/4 oz Gold Libertads and one 1/4 oz gold Somali Elephant from Apmex, the postage was $49 postage, then the bank charged me £35 non-STG transfer fee. Sadly I will not be buying any more from them which is a pity as they have such a variety of coins at very attractive prices.

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6 minutes ago, Xander said:

I purchased two 1/4 oz Gold Libertads and one 1/4 oz gold Somali Elephant from Apmex, the postage was $49 postage, then the bank charged me £35 non-STG transfer fee. Sadly I will not be buying any more from them which is a pity as they have such a variety of coins at very attractive prices.

Maybe to avoid the £35 non stg fee, I’ve used transferwise before to do a direct bank to bank transfer. My bank didn’t like using credit card to fund it but debit card is ok. Backyardbullion uses it too I think. There’s probably others ways like setting up a dollar account within your own bank but for a one off here and there purchase not worth it.

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3 hours ago, metallica73 said:

Yes, but then when forum members build up trust and trade between each other, i'd rather do that.

Indeed,but that takes time and kindness :)

I`d buy from you without hesitation.

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