Next lesson needed, bullion or numismatics?

[smokestack]

Ok guys, i have learned such a lot by being a member of this forum,i think its time for my next lesson in silver stacking. My original plan was just to stack only bullion for long term wealth preservation or savings if you like. However i have noticed that purely bullion collectors are a bit thin on the ground. I am now starting to wonder if i might be missing something with this. Can some of you tell me your thoughts on collecting numismatic coins, do you feel they are a better investment over purely bullion that sort of thing. I know there is no right and wrong with this but i just wanted to see some different views on this. It may be that you collect them just because you like them and that is fine, but i get the impression that some feel they are a better investment than just bullion. Thanks in advance for any thoughts on this.

[Agpanda]

I buy mostly seminumastics like Lunar, Koalas, Kookaburras and Pandas.

I think even if silverspot goes down, they keep prices better as there is a lot of people collecting them.

Pandas for exampel have over 1B people that now are allowed to own them.

I dont realy plan to sell my silver, but if i do i like to have many collectors wanting them 

Other coins, for exampel SGB series i buy couse i like them and what they stand for.

It was the same thing with SBSS in the beginning, before the started to mix with them.

I hope this help you a bit on the way.

 

Cheers

[silversword]

The numismatic route provides a nice bit of variety from pure bullion stacking. My opinion (and that's all it is) is that you shouldn't put all your eggs in one basket. Tastes change, and whats collectible today may not be so desirable in the future, or it might be even more valuable - nobody knows. Post-apocalypse your slabbed MS70 limited mintage proof coins will still be 1oz of silver but that's all they'll be and you'll have paid through the nose for them. Or maybe silver prices will plummet and your 1kg bars will be little more than tarnished doorstops and Maples will be used for propping up a wonky table. Maybe everything will go your way and you end up rich.

[Danny-boy]

I'm a collector purely as I'm obsessed with sets.

Simple as that, I like the hunt.

[HighlandTiger]

As I've said before, if you stick to a range similar to what STG has to offer, then you can't go wrong. A bit of bullion and a bit of semi numi. Covers both angles.

 

I'm very wary of buying anything in the over £100 bracket for the simple reason that at that price it's actually worth the counterfeiters to use real .999 silver in their copies. My gut feeling is that a good percentage of the high premium stuff is now faked and would take an extremely good expert to spot them

[klacey]

Im not a fan myself, i dont own a single one. I can see a long term benefit, but not short term, which is what im all about.

[Cornishfarmer]

The 1937 gold sovereign is an expensive coin so What is the holy grail of 1oz silver?

[Danny-boy]

The 1937 gold sovereign is an expensive coin so What is the holy grail of 1oz silver?

Not sure about 1oz, but the 1794 silver US dollar is pretty sought after (about $8M).

[Ares]

Is different to stacking that's for sure, it's a different mentality.

Buying for the pleasure of owning them trumping pleasure in the storage of wealth I suppose, helpfully supported by the fact they still are silver & gold we're talking about.

I like variety & I like collecting things, that's why I do it

[Danny-boy]

I see it as paying for the privilege of a second chance.

With bullion, you are screwed if the silver price drops dramatically, as it has for some on here.

With semi-numi, you have both the silver price and the collector value, but you pay for that second security level.

[HawkHybrid]

 

 

Buying for the pleasure of owning them trumping pleasure in the storage of wealth I suppose, helpfully supported by the fact they still are silver & gold we're talking about.

I disagree, numismatic are a store of wealth similar to that of fine wine and art.

think of it as something that is scarce and has a value based on how scarce it

is and how much demand. their storage of wealth is not merely down to their

component content.

 

HH

[Carpe Diem]

as always, it's down to your own research and the more you monitor changing prices and demand over a period of a few months to start with, then the more you'll get a feeling for what is popular.

 

It also depends on your overall plan, and you hinted at wealth preservation.  

 

With that in mind, I'd advocate diversity as personally, I'm not in a position financially to spend top dollar on some collectable stuff, but the way I counter that is by picking up pre 1920 British silver. Besides the fact that I like owning a piece of history and it being a reminder of a time that, although I didn't live in, I still feel nostalgic about because it's the closest thing to sound money we've had for a long time.  History aside though, you'll find you can pick up some pretty decent quality stuff for just over or even spot price if you persist.  The premiums on some of those are similar % ranges to the modern collectables like the kooks and pandas etc and so as long as you don't go for coins that look like they've had a punch up with a combine harvester, you should be able to retain some of the premium should the silver price fall, so I see them as a good hedge on the downside. which beings us back to wealth preservation.

[Ares]

I disagree, numismatic are a store of wealth similar to that of fine wine and art.

think of it as something that is scarce and has a value based on how scarce it

is and how much demand. their storage of wealth is not merely down to their

component content.

HH

Well, I'd respectfully disagree, mainly because in my own humble opinion as a collector the primary driver is not storing wealth, not by a long shot.

I've yet to meet a numismatist who treat it as an alternative store of wealth than doing it for the history, the act of collecting or whatever.

[Carpe Diem]

I've yet to meet a numismatist who treat it as an alternative store of wealth than doing it for the history, the act of collecting or whatever.

 

  should i get my coat?

[Ares]

Nah, just that when you spend significantly more than regular bullion on a coin 1/3 the size (like the stone mountain half), I find it very hard to imagine doing that hoping for the cash payout at the end.

At least, I wouldn't bank on it. If I wanted to make money I wouldn't touch numi. Stick to the bigger market

[HelpingHands]

Smokestack, you can remain a stacker but you can use numis to stack by flipping a year or two down the line providing silver will be a slow climb and not a rocket to the moon over night.

The cons being the effort to flip and once you have something shiny and special you might find it hard to sell.

[Ares]

The numi market is different to the stacking market. You don't see numi prices following spot as much, its quite resolute in the downturns, but even in upswings you can find coins the same price before.

Hope that makes some kind of sense. To make the big money in the numi market you need more than just spot price knowledge.

[motorbikez]

The original OP asked bullion or numi,my answer is whatever floats your boat, and the reason you are buying silver.There are a lot of different views put out by the guys and none is right or wrong, you have to do what's best for you.

 

I am purely a collector and I like the beauty and rarity of the proofs I collect, as HH mentioned I collect beautiful coins as opposed to art or wine.I am slightly addicted to coin runs or sets as are a few others here   not all proofs are expensive some of my nicest proofs have cost less than £30 others have cost £300 plus,its not really the money for me, its I like silver coins.

 

But as has been mentioned a lot of the rarer coins are totally disconnected from spot, there are a number of semi numi coins that are also sought after whatever spot is.eg try and buy a 2008 lunar mouse of any size except 1ozer and you'll see what I mean.

 

I started collecting in June 2012 and my 1st coins were bullion coins bought from a local dealer, amongst them was a proof Britannia and a proof RAM roo and that was it I was hooked on proofs and semi numi.

 

Just as an add on I do have a few hundred ozs of maples, eagles, phillys ,and brits which I will sell at some stage in the future, my proofs i'll keep and leave to my son & daughter.

[HawkHybrid]

playing semi numismatic requires a strategy, here's mine for rm horse.

 

buy and hold for 10 yrs. the cycle will then repeat and the year of the

dragon will emerge again. hopefully the dragon will inspire collectors

into backdating to complete their sets. sell into the rising demand and

by then reduced supply as some coins will have been lost/damaged

along the way.

 

dealers are numismatics who own ancient coins that they plan to

make a profit on?

 

HH 

[smokestack]

Well thank you everyone for your very interesting and diverse responses to my question. I f i was hoping to get a definitive answer i was dreaming. The only conclusion i can come to is as i think i suspected anyway is it really is a personal decision with no right or wrong. Although i still think of myself as a bullion collector i cannot deny feeling a pull towards buying some occasional semi numismatics just to keep things interesting. It will be fun to come back to this post in a years time to see if my strategy has changed.

[Ares]

Buy whatever you like yourself, otherwise you end up with stuff which others have said will make you money and you can't stand to look at it.

[ChrisSilver]

I have started to become more of a collector, it's more enjoyable.

The best way is to have two stacks, one for investment that you know you will most likely sell at some point in the future to release a profit and the other to keep that may or may not increase in value. Though these two stacks can easily cross over.

I have a collection of 1oz HR coins, hopefully they will hold their premiums but I am not that worried if they don't. I like owning them.

[Ares]

The best way is to have two stacks, one for investment that you know you will most likely sell at some point in the future to release a profit and the other to keep that may or may not increase in value. .

This is probably the best way to do it IMO if you get to a point where you start buying based on desire than financial gain. My stack is only collectable a right now but that's only because I don't have the finances to expand to stacking just yet.

[motorbikez]

I have started to become more of a collector, it's more enjoyable.

The best way is to have two stacks, one for investment that you know you will most likely sell at some point in the future to release a profit and the other to keep that may or may not increase in value. Though these two stacks can easily cross over.

 

 

That's the best way to look at it I am primarily a collector and if my coins go up or down I'm not fussed either way as they are for keeps and I get great pleasure looking at them from time to time.,I do however,have a few hundred ozs of bullion coins and a number of duplicate coins plus several ozs of gold coins which I will sell anytime i feel like it.

[simon13]

Plus you can get seminumi from STG or Estonia without VAT. I like the 2014 maples as bullion as they are cheap, recognisable and harder to fake than bars or other coins. I found a alibaba type website where you can order fake coins in bulk from china :s. Mostly gold, though.